i'm not saying they do, but it was suggested to me when i've explained to a couple of professionals my cravings at certain times.

i could put this in a few different forums (depression, weight) but i wanted to put it here because i'm looking for good alternatives to feed in a healthy way what my body seems to be craving.

i've ALWAYS craved carbs...an unnatural craving from my soul almost...so much so that i panic if i don't have soft pretzels or bread in the house. i remember being a little girl and getting 6 slices of bread at one time, balling it into a dough ball and eating it. anyhow, i'm doing it again, and have many, many times in my life.

it's to the point that it's all i want to eat. i was told before that it was odd how my body was telling me i was depressed and how to fix it. carbs are a natural antidepressant...with potentially bad side effects though...namely obesity

anyhow, i was reading and it appears true. it helps in the release of seretonin, but it's short lived and body craves more leading to full fledged addiction. i was shocked to read about it. i'm honestly NO DOUBT a carb addict...because the payoff in my brain and with mood

they suggested some good alternatives...omega3 fish fats and a couple of b vitamins. i need to read more. it answers so much for me.

seriously, the other night i had no pretzels and felt i could cry...confused by that...going to anything in the kitchen that might make up for them...eating several things then. it's a drive coming from i don't know where, that i rarely think about when acting upon...until recently, that is.

any information or relation is greatly appreciated.

KD

The drug Redux was developed by a biochemist who published the carb/serotonin link. His wife used to counsel patients to have some sweet before bed and it will help you sleep. The old milk/cookies = serotonin boost and tryptophan. Redux was recalled for affecting heart valves. But that story is true.

You can release serotonin by chewing also. Gum or anything crunchy is more satisfying for that reason.

The things that help depression:
chewing
sweets/carbs
DHA found in fish oil
B6 which is needed to make serotonin
magnesium which helps metabolize good fats
Proper light exposure for SAD
tryptophan or 5-HTP
folate (low folate has been shown to cause depression)

I was just reading up on the boards here about what I missed while on my summer break. And I saw a post of yours, Kimmy, that you are in "pain management". Drugs can cause depression, and if you are on opiates orally, they can depress the pituitary axis and change hormone ratios. Some drugs deplete nutrients just by their nature. If you want to PM me or email me for privacy I can look at that for you.

Eating carbs can affect insulin levels. About 1/4 of people in this country, can eat carbs/sugar and show no negative metabolic effects and remain slim.
But most others gain weight, and become insulin resistant and eventually may develop Type II diabetes.

There is some evidence that what you crave you are intolerant of. There is a very good doctor with a book and online site that explains this. I really think she is the closest to the truth I have seen yet.
Dr. Kittley (Jensen) at www.obesitysanswer.com
Her elimination diet reveals if you are intolerant to something, and if it is controlling your health. I have her book too.

The brain uses glucose only for energy. So carbs (high glycemic carbs) and sugar give instant gratification. The supplement inositol helps with metabolizing carbs in the brain-- it helps insulin. So Dr. Kittley suggests it in addition to the amino acid taurine to help with cravings.

So your seemingly simple question, is not so simple after all!

I am just starting tryptophan myself, and hope to find some good effects in this same area of appetite control. (serotonin is involved with appetite and some diet drugs were designed for this effect --Redux and Meridia. Unfortunately they affect heart valves and pulmonary artery blood pressure so have been discarded).

Thank you so much, mrsD!!! You are such a wealth of information, and your caring to share is so kind.

This just makes so much sense to me.

I was an overweight child (tho not obese), more "husky" and was that way until my second child. Not long after, over medication led to obesity and I lost 87 lbs. I've kept most of it off but claim to listen to my body now to do so. However, in doing so, have I developed a bad cycle when my body was attempting to fight off depression that it had known in the past, boost energy and mood to stave that off, or craving something I'm intolerant of?

I'm listening to my body alright. Too much so. In fact, I don't eat often enough, as much as I should, or what I should so that I can have those carbs I crave and not gain weight. It's now to the point that it's past conscious choice. It's habit and now my body doesn't tolerate well deviating from that schedule I've created for myself.

I'm not getting any younger and feeling the effects of this now.

I can look at myself honestly and see my going in for my "fixes" when needed. It's really wild to see actually. I'm glad I've not gained weight, but what price am I paying to continue?

I find the intolerant statement VERY interesting because this is something that I can date back to almost a toddler, so... Also, my mother is the same, but her's is more with sweets and sugars.

Thank you so much for the alternatives becasue I'm going to work very hard to get this under control. Yes, I've been through alot in the last year and I think anyone would be tired, but I'm pulling out of complete exhaustion.

I really am interested in the narcotic information as well even though I'm told what I take is very mild in comparison. Mild or no, it doesn't mean that it's not a med that might cause unwanted effects, yes? I will say that I don't "feel" depressed. I do wonder if I am due to the exhaustion, but I feel optomistic, even happy or elated lately. So I'm thinking that the carbs are giving me the energy to fight depression due to the long-lasting struggles of late? Also, I fought definite depressions prior to pain management...depressions I've not seen since.

I went into therapy at the same time that I went into pain management (I've not changed meds since - 6 yrs ago) and we discussed all the possible effects and watched for depression, etc. I only improved, and continued to. I seemed to reach a peak and have pretty much stayed there since.

I wonder if the instant gratification for me is the "boost" in mood and energy and that is fighting off what might otherwise become depression without it due to the last year of crisis IRL?

So interesting and I'm thrilled to have your information.

Thank you so much!

KD

I didn't expect to be "thrilling" LOL

I forgot something for the list.
Some people use SAMe for depression. I had that vacant moment, because I have been using SAMe since 1999 for arthritis, and I still succumbed to my winter depression last year! So I don't really think it works for me that way.
It does make me more alert however (so I don't need caffeine).

SAM is made in the body from B6, folic acid and B12 working on converting homocysteine to SAM. SAM then carries the methyl groups around the body to
repair things and make things (including neurotransmitters).

There is also in the research articles beginning to appear about food/addiction.
This is a stress cycle, and involves cortisol.
This is a really good explanation of it:
http://www.beyondchange-obesity.com/...Addiction.html

Increased stress does lead to depression, and alters neurotransmitters in the brain.
http://bjp.rcpsych.org/cgi/content/full/180/2/99

So I have been thinking about your question yesterday in more global terms.
I understand this cortisol link, because I have that response myself to stress.
I unfortunately learned it from an abusive childhood, and I can't seem to shake it myself.

I hope this helps you understand at least the chemistries, behind it all.
It is really a complex dynamic.

Thank you so much!

I'm learning about my unconscious actions and this is one of them. It took something really out of the norm to even be aware of it, and now that I am and there's explanation that fits me to the "T", I think it's wild.

Yes to the abusive childhood and I've found that to potentially be a link in others as well... I think there's a deep psychological "feel good" there in that a desperate child found that as a comfort...

Thank you for explaing re: SAM! I didn't know that...of course, that doesn't say much because I know next to nothing of these things...lol. It just makes really good sense in application to me, ya know? I feel that acute, prolonged stress started at a young age can and does change one's body and mind in several ways...

Thank you so much!

KD

Hi KimmyDawn,

Carbs are so useful, they also help us (me, at least, that's for sure) go to sleep.

A few years ago a woman who had been a chemist visted my web site and then wrote to thank me for the B12 information because it had been useful to her. She told me about the Eat Right for Your Blood Type Diet, and I looked into it.

Basically, since I didn't know my blood type, I found foods that were either neutral or benficial for all, and one of them was brown rice.

So I started eating that.

The woman who told me about it said that I could eat all the brown rice I wanted. (By then we were emailing)

So I began doing that, eating a LOT of it when I had a craving, and I did lose weight. She had said she had and that I would.

Recently when I didn't have electric I was reading an old Women's Health book that I have, and in it there was an explanation for why brown rice does that, but without my computer running, I failed to make note of where in the book the explanation was.

When I have had a lot of stress, like last year after I learned my condo had been foreclosed and sold without any hearing, I had huge bowls of brown rice several times a day, and yes... I continued to lose weight.

At that time, the Adult Protective Services people went to the store to get it for me, since then as now I couldn't drive. I had explained to them how upset I was and how I needed the brown rice to help me handle the stress.

Interestingly enough, there are B vitamins in brown rice, so that may be one reason it works so well for me. And, it gets rid of diarrhea, which many people with low B12 suffer from. Low B12 is associated with depression.

I write about the brown rice phenomenon on my page about how I lost 10 inches.

I have some brown rice on my candle right now.

B12 is from animal products.

Unless B12 has been added to another type of food, that food is not a source of B12.

rose

That's right. That's why I have a page on my site about the foods containing B12.

The fact is, however, that brown rice does contain B vitamins. I became aware of this when I tried chia seeds and got very sick. After that I found a good site which showed that brown rice has B vitamins, while chia seeds do not. For me, chia seeds did not work at all well, and I think that may be because I have some sort of celiac problem... which may be common in people with low B12 since the one doctor I saw and complained to about my diarrhea said it was just something people with low B12 had to learn to live with. But, once I went to eating brown rice instead of potatoes, the diarrhea went away, which was sooooo a miracle.

I agree that brown rice is a great food. Just wanted to make sure people did not misunderstand and think that brown rice contains B12.

rose

Oh, yes. Exactly.

I went back to see if I could write that bit more clearly, but I didn't see how without it getting awfully long.

So it's a good thing you drew attention.