Waves

I see no problem with you Taking a medical leave till
Sept. 1st, even knowing that you don't expect to return.

I believe that you will still consider the options on August 31st,
as to whether you are well enough to return.

Make the decision, that you aren't well enough to. And
give your notice.

So you aren't lying. And if you were to be able to keep your
pdoc appt. It would fall on a Wed. right.

Normal day.

Donna:grouphug:

Hi Donna,

just to clarify some things...

my pdoc appt is not always the same day/time. next week it is on tuesday 30th.

quit-wise, i'd want it to be effective Sept 1st. I still would not go in to work and calling in sick "informally as i have been doing. no leave involved.

leave-wise, it would be a month (i.e. ending Septemberr 30th, not sept 1st). i must be on leave at least 30 days for them to earn the right to "recede," presumably in this case, without penalty for them or me. (which brings me to Mari's question) ... coming up.

thanks for being here Donna. :hug:

~ waves ~

Mari...

regarding the term RECEDE... LOL sounds like a hairline. i transliterated. perhaps incorrectly.

by this term, i mean resigning but since i am not hired, it more accurately means, "terminating the contract prematurely." either party may do this with a 30 day notice period and motivated reason (transliteration again but no clue what it means so i can't translate it might as well say gobbledygook.)

in addition, if i took a medical leave for 30 days or more, they would have the right to "recede." (I am trying to think of a better word and drawing a blank right now forgive me.) Nothing is said about penalties but, typically, if a party violates a work contract by not giving the required notice, the usual penalty is to "pay off" the other for the portion of notice not given. so if i gave 2 weeks notice, i'd be penalized for the difference between 2 weeks and 30 days. most likely.

it is not legally possible to give notice while out sick, on leave or otherwise.

these things work rather differently here than in the US even though i think the principles are often similar... if people stay away too long, they find ways to get rid of you. hence the thought to take a leave... it might twist their arm and save me a month's pay.

my issue with this is it would be orchestrated. i don't feel comfortable with that. i realize there are shades of gray and lots of people do it. if i weren't ill, then my pdoc wouldn't even back me up. he said he's surprised i made it this far and that i need a rest. i will try to see the gp tomorrow ... hopefully he knows the state guidelines even for contract work.

i know lots of ppl do lots of things... that seem ok... but that i wouldn't do. i am not 100% on this one. but i am thinking it would hurt me emotionally more than the loss of money would... it would be a big chunk. paying for pdoc now, plus other expenses not the least of which lunch out almost every day, i was not able to save a whole lot. but it still doesn't sit right with me... i don't know.

i'll talk to the GP. he may say he can't do it and that will clinch it.

thanks for stopping in, and all the thoughts. i appreciate your support. (((hugs)))

~ waves ~

p.s. WordReference forums gives me "withdraw" as the correct translation in regard to contracts.

reconsidering leave - coherence / consistency
 

My dad pointed out that my actions should be coherent. so i have thought about this aspect:-

Quitting due to protracted illness would seem strange when there is a provision for it in the contract. on the other hand, quitting for a different reason right now might suggest prior "sick" days were faked, possibly for interviews. (people here think these things.)

--------

i saw my gp - had no problem, said he would give me 30 days, more if pdoc wants more, and no piece of paper needed from pdoc either. (i almost fell over backwards in the chair.:o)

i reread the legal clause that gives the contractor the right to withdraw. this occurs after a medical leave longer than 1/6 of the contract term, which for me would have to be more than 30 days , since my contract is SEVEN MONTHS.

the leave is unpaid which relieves me a bit of guilt. but the GP says it gets filed through the state and they send to the employer. theoretically a diagnosis SHOULD not be present on the employer copy but GP can't be sure. he said he would put something generic like "depressive syndrome."

For leave as of Sept 1st, i have to go back to GP on that same day. I want to push it off till then because I have pdoc appt on 30th (worst that can happen is they drop me now, so what! :rolleyes:) because i want to ask pdoc:

-- can he recommend 40 days.
-- can he suggest an alternative diagnosis that is more like... "stress syndrome" which...

... would be completely in line with what has been going on for months i.e. the excessive and intractable migraines, thought to be stress-induced. the contractor was informed of that, hence 100% coherence.

anyway, if i take leave but he does not dump me, i can then resign saying something like, "After much consideration and following medical advice, i have decided that for the sake of my own health i need to pursue a different line of work." the contractor should remember that before our first contract, i had told him i wanted to give up the programming job search and go into teaching. he persuaded me to remain open to both. but he really shouldn't be too surprised.

anyway. still up in the air for now as to which road to take.

:grouphug:

thanks all for listening.

~ waves ~

Waves

You are thinking more rationally again. And your doc's are on line with
you too. It also sounds like your dad is too.

So you are doing good.


Wow, I think great. I think you are doing great.

Keep it up.

donna:grouphug:

seems as if it's all coming together .... ?
 

Sounds thoroughly "coherent" to me. 110%, as the Harvard MBAs usta say. You've got to get some relief, & you've got to get it fast. Looks to as if it could happen ....

sick leave "concerns"
 

the major worries about sick leave are:-

1. the employer can and (personal experience) often does... just to "see how you are doing." i mean there is no law against it. that would stress me out BIGTIME. :(

2. if it goes through the state, they have a right to send someone to verify your presence at your home during 2 2-hour time frames each day, without notice. as a sickie, you are supposed to be there. right now, i'm a home body anyway. but once i am up to it, getting out would be good for me. however, from where i live, it is impossible to go too far (eg bus to city, do something there) if i have to run back home for 2 hours in the morning, and 2 more in the afternoon! talk about STRESS!!!

i don't believe either can be avoided. i will ask both docs about #2.

~ waves ~

Dear Waves,

THanks for the "recede" /withdraw explanation. I think I get it.

If this medical status is stressing you out, do a clean quit.

Are you going through the medical "leave" because of money? Is money the main (only) issue? Are there benefits to the medical "leave" / withdrawal besides not having to pay money?

I want you to remind yourself that you have done very well surviving those work place environments. You are at a different place than you were a year ago.

If two MDs are telling you that you can't do the job at this moment in time, doesn't that take some of the pressure off your need to make decisions? They are taking some of the pressure off your trying to think this through . . I would think.

M

It's the projecting...
 

Well, now, you got me with this because it takes me back to my hospital time two yrs ago. I was out of sick & personal time AWA accrued vacation leave. If I wasn't back at work on Monday they could drop my contract. (If I went back on Monday they would still drop my contract--but because I had freaked out .... or acted out .... or otherwise made the evening news....)

Different situation, but I think I was having a lot of the same sorts of feelings. I kept trying to jump over today to try to figure what they were going to do tomorrow. I felt that I had to figure all the variables & to do X to produce their Z. It all worked out finally to my benefit, but I don't know how.

So I'm sending all the strong, positive good-for-you vibes I can get together--sort of a Good-Energy-O'Gram--& sending it your way, ~ waves ~ , along with the observation that you seem to have slowed down your thinking process, perhaps by writing things out so clearly in your posts. I don't know. But you seem to be making better decisions beginning with not going back to work last Monday.:hug:

the devil and the deep blue sea
 

Not really. the leave would be consistent with my absences until now. it would look better, esp given the certification this time.

if i knew or thought a clean quit would save me money i'd do it consistency or not. it's more likely the health leave will save me money, but worst case cost won't be worse than a clean quit. i feel better about the health leave based on what my doctors are saying. and also due to the whole consistency thing. flipside, is i don't like the feeling tied... having to report... rrrrghhh.

either route is a gamble moneywise. i haven't decided which to take yet. various things could happen (i don't know and can't handle finding out all the legal nooks and crannies):

medical leave + they drop me:

i wouldn't owe anything.

medical leave + they don't drop me + i quit:

i would owe 1 and 1/2 months pay (= net pay received, plus the taxes they paid the state.)

clean quit as of Sept 1, could go 2 ways:

1. IF he has a legal obligation to pay august - most likely so.
i would owe 1 and 1/2 month's pay (break down as before). i know that for hired workers it is done this way, however that is a different type of contract and it may be more clearly specified.

2. IF he has the option not to pay out august:
i wouldn't owe anything.

there may be other "solutions" i haven't thought of.

yeah... probably. but i am still very holed up at the moment. can't take stimuli. not only. while i was much more apathetic before, now, (i can't believe this) i am seeing activation again - in a bad way. hypersensitive. nervous energy, rabid dreams, lability. not a good place, albeit different.

well yes - and guilt/sense of honesty dealy.

i think i am going to take some lorazepam now. i was reluctant but pdoc says if i want to take it daily for a while it's ok. i didn't want to get addicted. it's almost as bad as Xanax if you consider the dosage. maybe i'll try just taking half.

:grouphug:

~ waves ~