[redjpwranglergirl]

First off, let me explain the point of this thread. On "my forum" , we have a thread called "Today I......", started by a very kind, supportive person, who always has a good word for everyone, and it was a great idea. To date, it has over 12,000 replies to it. We use it to post what's going on with our lives, how we're feeling, to check up on how others are doing, to vent, and so on. Maybe something like that has a place here, maybe not. If not, it can just die away. Before I go any further, I want to thank Thelma for her last post on the "bt" thread- makes alot of sense.

My thoughts today, for what it's worth are this- It's true that people can/will get their feelings hurt in a forum or office or whatever, whether there's 10 people working/reading there or 10,000. Sometimes the whole purpose of saying/doing something is to hurt someone else, but most of the time I think it's not done on purpose- especially when what is said isn't directed at anyone or a person's name isn't specifically called. I admit that at times it might be hard to know if something is really directed at you specifically but generally if it's something that the poster openly says is THEIR opinion and is making a generalization about something, it's not directed at any one person or persons. But, when it's turned around on someone and a person is named, for their post, it really does become hurtful and even worse when it appears that others are ganging up on them. The thing with forums, unless we all post at ALL of the forums on here, we don't "know" each other. We might make an assumption about someone who doesn't post on any of our forums, by going by one post on Community Feedback or on one particular forum, without knowing how that person is on "their" forum and without knowing anything about that person or their situation.

Some more observations:
1). Sometimes people need to ask themselves before they attack someone who has differing opinion than they do, how they would feel if that was done to them. Is one person's opinion more valuable than anothers? The next time someone has an opinion different from yours and you'd like to censor these people, ask yourself how you would feel if someone tried to censor you. I'm afraid that I can't see any justification in it. If you feel that you should be able to say whatever you want, at all costs, then the same should apply to those who you disagree with.

2). We all have pain, illnesses, disabilities, and what have you. Some are worse than others, but we all have problems and things we have to deal with in our daily lives. Some of us have health problems other than what we post about on NT. Some of us also have family members with severe, life-threatening health problems that we seldom talk about on here. Some of us are "old" (I'll be 50 this year so I'm probably alot older than alot of people here), tired, cranky,etc. and it can make us crabby at times, BUT- that doesn't excuse bad behaviour and bad manners and being rude to others, plain and simple....

3). Just because you don't "see" something going on on a particular forum, whether it's bt, NT, or one of the topics on a forum, doesn't mean it doesn't exist or never happened. I have no idea what goes on on the forums I don't ever visit so why would I generalize and say that such and such never happened there? I've never "seen" Europe, but I'm sure it exists. I've never seen a panda but I'm sure it exists. I've never seen Brad Pitt but I'm sure he exists, and so on.....

4). Last but not least, this forum is, or should be, for everyone- not just the ones we agree with. If you think otherwise, ask yourself why- better yet, come on here and openly state why you think "Bob" or "Mary" isn't entitled to an opinion and shouldn't post here. Isn't a forum for everyone? We're not always going to agree with everyone else- for heaven's sake, my husband and I don't always agree with each other and we live together and love each other so I realize that thousands of people posting on a forum aren't going to always agree. As long as people think that they should be exempt from what they "demand" from others, well....I'd like to know the reasoning behind that.

*THESE ARE MY THOUGHTS AND MY THOUGHTS ONLY. NOT DIRECTED AT ANY ONE PERSON OR GROUP OF PEOPLE.

[Alffe]

Once upon a time, there was a nonconforming sparrow
who decided not to fly south for the winter.

However, soon the weather turned so cold that he reluctantly
started to fly south. In a short time ice began to form on his
wings and he fell to earth in a barnyard, almost frozen.

A cow passed by and crapped on the little sparrow. The sparrow thought it was the end. But, the manure warmed him and defrosted
his wings. Warm and happy, able to breathe, he started to sing.

Just then a large cat came by and hearing the chirping, investigated the sounds. The cat cleared away the manure, found the chirping bird and
promptly ate him.

~~~~The Moral of the story~~~~

1. Everyone who s***s on you is not necessarily your enemy.

2. Everyone who gets you out of the s***, is not necessarily your friend.

3. And, if you're warm and happy in a pile of s***, keep your mouth shut.

[Lara]

LOL Alffe

[redjpwranglergirl]

OK- I give up. Your point taken, my point proven.

[kimmydawn]

I agree with alot of this...

I know it's hard when we are a person alone, sitting and reading a post. I can be so easy to internalize due to the personal interaction...me alone, reading the the other person. It feels more like a two-way conversation, so internalizing or assuming comments can be so much more easily done. I noticed that about myself when I first ventured into the online world and figured that was why then...after several times of realizing a person didn't even have me close in thought when posting.

If a person was criticizing and being general, I could immediately say to myself, "Ugh! Why would they say that about me?"...immediately. I think that's due to the appearance of one on one when deeply enmeshed in a thread.

That's another reason that I like to use "I statements" and "I examples" just as I did above. I related my experience to the misconceptions then understanding, but to also state where I stand on the comments, ya know?

It is difficult not to respond in like when we read highly emotional threads...whether they're defensive, crying for help, criticizing, adoring. It's much that way in the real world as well...it's a natural "being in the moment".

I think you touched on the golden rule when asking a person to ask themselves how they would feel. That's alot the way I relate to others...how I like to be interacted with...respect, not being "told", sharing understanding, etc.

I think it's really important to know that, if we make a public post or comment, we should be willing to accept response...even those that differ from ours. That said, it doesn't mean we should have to "take" a response that's attacking, ugly, flaming, etc. However, disagreement we should be able to accept. Agreed. Someone wanting to state their view opposite to ours respectfully should be accepted. Agreed. That's what makes conversation and allows us to learn and grow as individuals...to see the other side...etc.

Alot of plain and simple *acceptance* is a part of life, and forum communications...accepting response, differening opinions, different experiences, disagreeing friends, bad moods, good moods, moderation, I could go on but I think I made that point.

Absolute agreement in that this community should be for ANYONE who wants/needs to use it for its intended purposes, and it is. Again, and action required there...acceptance.

There's not one of us who is perfect, in a good mood all the time, not in some kind of pain at some point, etc. It happens and that's generally accepted and known...including by the moderation/administration team. I, for instance, have made a couple of judgments I ordinarily wouldn't have made had my life not been so chaotic and I was rushed, didn't take time to get the whole story, read further, etc. It does happen for us all and as a community we generally accept that from the other. I'm proud to see that.

I think y'all are great, and just because there's an upset or a guideline crossed, it doesn't mean that those thoughts or feelings change...not one iota. Hopefully y'all will know me long enough to figure that out.

Love,

KD

[redjpwranglergirl]

Originally Posted by kimmydawn

I agree with alot of this...

I know it's hard when we are a person alone, sitting and reading a post. I can be so easy to internalize due to the personal interaction...me alone, reading the the other person. It feels more like a two-way conversation, so internalizing or assuming comments can be so much more easily done. I noticed that about myself when I first ventured into the online world and figured that was why then...after several times of realizing a person didn't even have me close in thought when posting.

If a person was criticizing and being general, I could immediately say to myself, "Ugh! Why would they say that about me?"...immediately. I think that's due to the appearance of one on one when deeply enmeshed in a thread.

That's another reason that I like to use "I statements" and "I examples" just as I did above. I related my experience to the misconceptions then understanding, but to also state where I stand on the comments, ya know?

It is difficult not to respond in like when we read highly emotional threads...whether they're defensive, crying for help, criticizing, adoring. It's much that way in the real world as well...it's a natural "being in the moment".

I think you touched on the golden rule when asking a person to ask themselves how they would feel. That's alot the way I relate to others...how I like to be interacted with...respect, not being "told", sharing understanding, etc.

I think it's really important to know that, if we make a public post or comment, we should be willing to accept response...even those that differ from ours. That said, it doesn't mean we should have to "take" a response that's attacking, ugly, flaming, etc. However, disagreement we should be able to accept. Agreed. Someone wanting to state their view opposite to ours respectfully should be accepted. Agreed. That's what makes conversation and allows us to learn and grow as individuals...to see the other side...etc.

Alot of plain and simple *acceptance* is a part of life, and forum communications...accepting response, differening opinions, different experiences, disagreeing friends, bad moods, good moods, moderation, I could go on but I think I made that point.

Absolute agreement in that this community should be for ANYONE who wants/needs to use it for its intended purposes, and it is. Again, and action required there...acceptance.

There's not one of us who is perfect, in a good mood all the time, not in some kind of pain at some point, etc. It happens and that's generally accepted and known...including by the moderation/administration team. I, for instance, have made a couple of judgments I ordinarily wouldn't have made had my life not been so chaotic and I was rushed, didn't take time to get the whole story, read further, etc. It does happen for us all and as a community we generally accept that from the other. I'm proud to see that.

I think y'all are great, and just because there's an upset or a guideline crossed, it doesn't mean that those thoughts or feelings change...not one iota. Hopefully y'all will know me long enough to figure that out.

Love,

KD

You're right KD. I imagine we all know that people aren't going to agree with us all the time and vice versa. That's to be expected and welcomed . I can't speak for anyone else but myself but it doesn't bother me that everybody doesn't agree with me and the fact that they don't isn't what bothers me. What I get upset about is when people don't practice what they preach. No matter how long I roll it around in my head, I can't understand how one can expect to say what they think and it be OK but not apply that to others. In some cases, I think there's no point in continuing to "beat a dead horse" because it just continues to cause hurt in one way or another. At my age I certainly know that other people aren't going to like what I say, but I don't think that it's respectful to reply to someones post by implying that they shut their mouth or with laughter toward them. I didn't know that I was that funny. If treating someone like this is funny and makes you feel better about yourself, then shame on you.

[Lara]

For the record, 'cause you seem so upset, redjpwranglergirl.

I wasn't laughing at you.

I was laughing at seeing Alffe post a post which had swear words in it. I also don't believe that Alffe was laughing at you either or was she telling you to keep your mouth shut.

I think there's a heck of a lot of misunderstanding going on here this morning.

and

My posts to you last night when I wrote them were not posted in any other manner than a calm manner. There was absolutely no anger or any other negative feeling in my responses when I wrote them. I was just responding to what you had written and I thought I had made that clear. No upset, no anger. Just how I felt about what had been said.

[kimmydawn]

I want to change something I said.

I said that hopefullly y'all will know me long enough to "figure that out". That was a poor choice of words.

What I meant was, hopefully y'all will know me long enough to KNOW that about me...as a standard that I reflect in my actions and words.

KD