I brought my 4yo son Anthony (5/9/03) to a pedi neurologist yesterday hoping to find out exactly what is going on with him. We knew he had Sensory Integration issues already (sensory seeker). She confirmed that, and says that he has definitely neurological impairment, the root of everything is neurological... (SID, hypotonia, oral motor, apraxia etc). Anyway she thinks he may be having seizure activity and he's having an EEG on Wednesday. If it comes back abnormal, then she said he needs to come in right away, I think for meds. If the EEG is normal, then she said he still has neurological impairment, just that you can't see on the EEG.

He has tics, which the school OT thought was stimming due to his sensory issues. The neuro says it is not stimming but tics. He had LOTS of eye blinking for 8 months or so and then stopped for a month or two. The blinking came back last week, along with a vocal tic. He also does something with his lips too but not as often as the constant blinking/vocal. She did not bring up Tourette's so I assumed it was not suspected. But now I'm starting to think that even if he is having seizures, he may still have Tourette. I can't really find info on kids with epilepsy having vocal tics. From researching his motor AND vocal tics, it sure looks like Tourette's. So now I am thinking that she didn't bring up Tourette just because it hasn't been a year yet... will be a year in about September (that he's had the blinking) and that is when she said to go back (if the EEG is normal, if it's abnormal he goes back sooner).

I am hoping the EEG is extremely reliable in diagnosing it? I mean, if he doesn't happen to have one during the EEG, then will his EEG come out as "normal"? I don't want it to be missed if he really does have it. I know they said he would be sedated during it. It might be both awake and sedated and I think they said it is for 2 hours total.

Can kids with Epilepsy can have vocal tics??? Are Sensory Integration problems common in kids with petit mal seizures? Are tics common??

Any advice/thoughts???

Thanks so much!

Dawn

((((((((((((Dawn)))))))))))))))) and (((((((((((((Anthony))))))))))))))).

I hate to say this, but no, I hate EEGs for the very reason that they [I]lack[I] accuracy in many cases and are not a particularly reliable diagnostic tool. They only pick up sz activity if it's occurring during the EEG. I have had normal readings during long periods of recurrent sz activity, and abnormal readings when I went without szs for years. Now, I'm talking about the "basic" 30-min EEG, but if he has a longer monitoring, such as 24-48 hour, or a video EEG, you may get more accurate results. If the "simple" EEG is normal, ask for a longer monitoring, or a V(ideo)EEG. Also, make sure a CT and/or MRI are done, too. It can help get to the bottom of what's going on.

Good luck!

LIZARD

Dawn
I think you are wise to consider all possibilities and certainly with eye blinking and a vocal tic, there may well be TS or a "transient tic disorder"..the latter being failry common in kids and caused by a variety of issues

my son manifest his tics around age 4 with eye rolling and blinking a a squeaking noise and we had all kinds of dx, ranging from possible brain damage to optic issues, but it wasnt until aged 10 that a savvy developmental pediatrician dx him correctly with TS

do stop by the TS forum here too if you would like some input from others on the tics aspect

all the best to you and I hope you find clear answers and effective treatment
Cheri

Dawn

I am sorry to read about your son and what you are going through. It must be scary at this moment. I dont know much about the symptoms that your son is having but I am happy that you found us and wanted to say welcome and give you a big hug . This a wonderful place with caring supportive people that really help in so many ways. I see you have met Cheri and Lizard who have some insights and thoughts for you.

Please let us know how Anthony manages the EEG. I'll be checking in for any updates,

Hi Dawn,
I'm so sorry to hear about the problems your son is having it does sound like TS but then I ask myself the question with all the rapid blinking of his eyes if maybe he isn't having a complex partial seizure (sz.) If I may ask does your son ever smack his lips, wander around the house, or pull at his clothing for no reason and then seem confused and tired after? If this is happening it is a complex partial sz. I have had both absence (petit mal) and complex partial sz. for 35 yrs.
I agree with everyone else an e.e.g. will not show any seizure activity unless your son is having a sz. in my case it didn't even show all the brain damage until I had a video e.e.g where the surgeon had to put 7 depth electrodes directly on my brain.
I saw many different neuro. over the yrs. but I never got much help until I saw an Epileptologist (Dr. specializing in Epilepsy) and I was sure to go to an Epilepsy Center which are often found at University Hospitals.
My advice to you is to have your son have an MRI, CT scan, along with a Pet and Spect scan this will really show what's going on in his brain. Take note if he has a lot of headaches, seems confused at times and isn't sure where he's at. This can happen to people who have cp sz. Keep your son away from anything with nutra sweet (aspartame) in it because it been proven that aspartame causes more electrical activity in the brain and can sometime cause sz. for people. Also take note if bright lights bother him and sometimes a low pressure coming in will cause some people to have seizures.
Here's a couple of websites to check out if your interested

www.epilepsy.com

http://www.neuropat.dote.hu/neurology.htm
Click on Epilepsy to get a lot of great info.

Here's wishing you and your son the best of luck and May God Bless You!

Sue

Thanks so much, everyone. I can tell this is a very supportive place! That is great!

He does do some type of lip smacking but not necessaily while walking around. I've seen him doing that while sitting down lots of times. This started a little over a week ago, along with the vocal tic and blinking (blinking returned, the others were new). I don't *think* that he gets tired. I think what the neuro suspects is the absence seizures, because she noted him staring off blankly in the office and when she called him, he didn't respond right away. I've seen him to that as well but he is only 4 and does seem a little spacy at times so I didn't think much of it.

I'm really on the fence about what it is.. seems like it could be the petit mal, but that doesn't really explain the vocal tic, does it? Unless he had both

Thanks for all the help!

Hi Dawn,
Thanks for sharing the info. with me. Often when I have a cp sz. I will smack my lips and sometimes I wander around. When I have an absence seizure I have a daydream look on my face and I stare for a few seconds but I wll continue to talk to others and walk around the house or work doing whatever I was doing ex. getting dinner I just don't remember anything it's like amnesia for a few seconds.
It's up to you but you might want to try putting your son on vitamin B12 or B complex vitamins. I found that taking vitamin B12 helps the nervous system and it has decreased my seizures greatly.
Also if you have an extra calendar around your house write down what time your son is having a sz. along with a descripition of the sz. by doing this the Dr. can often see a pattern as to what time of day or night he's more likely to have any sz. or what days of the month he will have more sz. A vocal tic can cause sz. I work in public school and I saw how a tic affected a student I had that caused the student to have seizures. I wish you and your son the best of luck and May God Bless You Both!

Sue

I tried to take some video, either by hiding the camera or pretending to play with the camera, telling him I was trying to fix it or something. If he thinks I'm taking pictures, he'll say "Cheese!" LOL

You can see blinking, lips, and when it's quiet enough (I have 3 kids in my house and a dog!) you can sometimes hear his vocal tic if you turn the speakers up. Here he is:

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v1...t=MVI_1274.flv

http://http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v11/ives6797/?action=view&current=MVI_1277.flv

http://http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v11/ives6797/?action=view&current=MVI_1278.flv

Any thoughts??

Dawn

I just showed the videos to my friend and she pointed out that in teh middle video of him at the table, his eyes are rolling or something, when he opens his eyes sometimes they are in a different spot.... hmmm, wonder if that means anything?

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v1...t=MVI_1277.flv

I had reviewed the videos

I SAW something in 2 videos - his eyes ROCKED and
they did ROLL upwards right after he blinked, which
is typical of a seizure-type behavior and not of a TIC
type behavior.

I am NOT a MEDICAL DOCTOR. I have had friends who
have TICS and they DO NOT have these types of
behaviors in what 2 of the videos that I saw, never had it,
and I had known them for 10-30 years before they all
moved away out of to different States. None of them
displayed anything like what your son is displaying.

I recommend a 2nd opinion if all possible and necessary,
or contact your Local Hospital for Epilepsy Support
Resource Group or Epileptologist Specialist which would
be far better for your son... AND BRING THOSE VIDEOS!