[Undecided80]

Hi All,
So I know smoking is bad in general for anyone, though I was curious to hear about how smoking makes MS worse? That may sound like a stupid question though I'm wondering "how" it makes MS worse.

Thanks!

[ewizabeth]

Smoking causes inflammation throughout the human body and it is thought that MS is a disease worsened by inflammation. I have heard many people say that those with MS and smoking will have a much worse time with the disease. And research is beginning to show that now as well.

I have a niece with MS who has always smoked, diagnosed about the same age as me. She has total disability and has for more than five years, with only the use of her right hand now. I am 54 years old and still walking, and working full time. I quit smoking in my early 20s. If you smoke, quit, if not for your MS, then for your quality of life in general and for your family.

[Undecided80]

Originally Posted by ewizabeth

Smoking causes inflammation throughout the human body and it is thought that MS is a disease worsened by inflammation. I have heard many people say that those with MS and smoking will have a much worse time with the disease. And research is beginning to show that now as well.

I have a niece with MS who has always smoked, diagnosed about the same age as me. She has total disability and has for more than five years, with only the use of her right hand now. I am 54 years old and still walking, and working full time. I quit smoking in my early 20s. If you smoke, quit, if not for your MS, then for your quality of life in general and for your family.

Thank you so much for your enlightening reply. Hearing about real comparisons is what I need and you have done that perfectly. I have noticed the less I smoke my symptoms aren't as bad, and was just curious as to why and how that would be. I know smoking depletes oxygen, and was wondering how that worked in with the inflammation? How does swelling occur with lack of oxygen? Sorry if I'm asking silly questions, I'm new to all this with just being diagnosed Oct 2011.

Thank you again.

[Jules A]

Originally Posted by Undecided80

Thank you so much for your enlightening reply. Hearing about real comparisons is what I need and you have done that perfectly. I have noticed the less I smoke my symptoms aren't as bad, and was just curious as to why and how that would be. I know smoking depletes oxygen, and was wondering how that worked in with the inflammation? How does swelling occur with lack of oxygen? Sorry if I'm asking silly questions, I'm new to all this with just being diagnosed Oct 2011.

Thank you again.

These aren't silly questions! I enjoy thoughtful posts that result in stimulating conversation. This is how we learn and then share what we know.

This article offered some thoughts on the nuts and bolts of why smoking might be extra bad for people with ms. From: http://aje.oxfordjournals.org/content/154/1/69.full

"How smoking may be related to the increased incidence of MS is unclear. The link might depend on the immuno-modulatory effects of smoking, although the evidence is sketchy. Different components of cigarette smoke may cause either immunosuppression (e.g., nicotine) or immuno-stimulation (e.g., tobacco glycoprotein) (3, 4). A predisposition to autoimmune responses in smokers has been suggested (34), and indeed, smoking has been found to be associated with an elevated risk of developing some autoimmune diseases, such as rheumatoid arthritis (8⇔⇔⇔–12), systemic lupus erythematosus (6, 7), Graves' disease (35, 36), and Crohn's disease (37), but not others, such as Hashimoto's thyroiditis (36) and ulcerative colitis (37).

An alternative mechanism could involve a direct effect of cigarette smoke components on the blood-brain barrier. Nicotine has been shown to increase microvascular blood flow on the brain (38, 39) and to raise the influx of permeable solutes across the blood-brain barrier in rats (40). Leakage of the blood-brain barrier has been suggested as an initiating event in the development of MS (41).

Another possibility is that some components of cigarette smoke may have direct toxic effects on the central nervous system. Cyanide, a component of cigarette smoke (42), for which levels in the blood—and levels of its main metabolite, thiocyanate—are strongly correlated with amount of smoking (43, 44), has long been known to cause demyelination in the central nervous system of animals administered comparatively large (45⇔⇔⇔⇔⇔⇔⇔⇔⇔–55), and possibly also lower (2, 56), doses. Demyelination is produced more successfully with repeated doses of cyanide than with one single, massive dose. This compound has also been implicated in epidemics of tropical spastic paraparesis (57, 58) and optic neuropathy (5, 59), diseases that share some clinical features with MS but that are characterized by symmetric bilateral symptoms and no history of relapses (5, 60).

Smoking might also increase the risk of MS by increasing the frequency and persistence of respiratory infections (13). For example, some reports (61) describe an association between Chlamydia pneumoniae infection and MS, and it has been shown that C. pneumoniae-specific antibodies are higher in smokers than in nonsmokers (62, 63). However, this association has not been confirmed (64), and the relevance of any of these or other mechanisms to the association between smoking and MS remains to be established."

[Dejibo]

before I knew I had MS my blood work went screwy with inflammation. The MD told me in no cut terms. you MUST quit or some bad things are about to happen to you. She said my CRP was off the chart, my inflammatory markers were going wild, so she predicted some event headed at me and the best thing I could do was quit. So...I quit. my blood work improved, my other indicators dropped, and while it wasnt easy, it was the best thing I ever did for myself. Now with them at 7 and 8 dollars a pack im glad I did.

[Undecided80]

Originally Posted by Dejibo

before I knew I had MS my blood work went screwy with inflammation. The MD told me in no cut terms. you MUST quit or some bad things are about to happen to you. She said my CRP was off the chart, my inflammatory markers were going wild, so she predicted some event headed at me and the best thing I could do was quit. So...I quit. my blood work improved, my other indicators dropped, and while it wasnt easy, it was the best thing I ever did for myself. Now with them at 7 and 8 dollars a pack im glad I did.

Hi Dejibo,

Thanks for your reply. I know Im going to have to give up. I can remember when I got my first MS symptom which was a tingling tongue I went and seen the Dr. Went my blood results came back she said all my symptoms along with the tingling tongue were from smoking.

I was annoyed to say the least, because I didn't think that was possible. I feel it could make me unhealthy but not cause all the symptoms I was having.

I am definately going to start the thought process of giving up and I will slowly cut down until I need them no longer.

Thanks for all your help.

[Undecided80]

Originally Posted by SallyC

Well, I smoked for 50 years and enjoyed almost every minute of it. When I got older(late 60s, I began to hate the tobacco smoke in my house and in my lungs, so I quit.

Because I always enjoyed the act of smoking (very relaxing), I purchased some E-cigs about 5/6 years ago and never looked back. I still have the joy of puffing vapor (looks like smoke until it dissipates)

I found, through experience and investigation, that Nicotine was good for MS as it is sort of Neuro protective. Sooooo, I have a little, not a lot of nicotine in my Vaper Juice.

I was never convinced that my light smoking (pack per day) was causing me much, if any, ill health and it didn't have any long term effects. My lungs are clear, my heart is strong and my BP is normal.

I realize that many smokers, especially heavy smokers, can and do suffer Illnesses, some leading to death. I was lucky as are others who smoke until they die of natural causes.

I admit my lungs and whole body felt and feel better/healthier, without the Tobacco smoke, though and my house is so much cleaner.

I am now taking a long puff of my Joye Ciggy and blowing the harmless vapor atcha.... BTW, the hospital let me have my vapor puffs, while there in November..

Hi Sally!

Thank you for your reply! Your a beautiful breath of fresh air!

I too enjoy my smoking. I actually roll my own and just use pipe tobacco - so supposedly they are a lot less harmful because they dont have the same amount of nicotine in them. Do you know if this is true?

I do feel worse if say I smoke Marlboros compared to just the rollies. It might just be a silly little part in my brain thinking that, though Im pretty certain its what Im experiencing.

I have heard about the E Cigs but as it goes, supposedly they are just as bad for you? What do you know about them?

Reading the WWW can sometimes be more harm then good with the wide range of opinions so like I said in my previous post, I like hearing from real experiences then truly believing what I read.

I would love to hear what you have to say about them.

Thanks!

[Undecided80]

Originally Posted by Jules A

These aren't silly questions! I enjoy thoughtful posts that result in stimulating conversation. This is how we learn and then share what we know.

This article offered some thoughts on the nuts and bolts of why smoking might be extra bad for people with ms.

"How smoking may be related to the increased incidence of MS is unclear. The link might depend on the immuno-modulatory effects of smoking, although the evidence is sketchy. Different components of cigarette smoke may cause either immunosuppression (e.g., nicotine) or immuno-stimulation (e.g., tobacco glycoprotein) (3, 4). A predisposition to autoimmune responses in smokers has been suggested (34), and indeed, smoking has been found to be associated with an elevated risk of developing some autoimmune diseases, such as rheumatoid arthritis (8⇔⇔⇔–12), systemic lupus erythematosus (6, 7), Graves' disease (35, 36), and Crohn's disease (37), but not others, such as Hashimoto's thyroiditis (36) and ulcerative colitis (37).

An alternative mechanism could involve a direct effect of cigarette smoke components on the blood-brain barrier. Nicotine has been shown to increase microvascular blood flow on the brain (38, 39) and to raise the influx of permeable solutes across the blood-brain barrier in rats (40). Leakage of the blood-brain barrier has been suggested as an initiating event in the development of MS (41).

Another possibility is that some components of cigarette smoke may have direct toxic effects on the central nervous system. Cyanide, a component of cigarette smoke (42), for which levels in the blood—and levels of its main metabolite, thiocyanate—are strongly correlated with amount of smoking (43, 44), has long been known to cause demyelination in the central nervous system of animals administered comparatively large (45⇔⇔⇔⇔⇔⇔⇔⇔⇔–55), and possibly also lower (2, 56), doses. Demyelination is produced more successfully with repeated doses of cyanide than with one single, massive dose. This compound has also been implicated in epidemics of tropical spastic paraparesis (57, 58) and optic neuropathy (5, 59), diseases that share some clinical features with MS but that are characterized by symmetric bilateral symptoms and no history of relapses (5, 60).

Smoking might also increase the risk of MS by increasing the frequency and persistence of respiratory infections (13). For example, some reports (61) describe an association between Chlamydia pneumoniae infection and MS, and it has been shown that C. pneumoniae-specific antibodies are higher in smokers than in nonsmokers (62, 63). However, this association has not been confirmed (64), and the relevance of any of these or other mechanisms to the association between smoking and MS remains to be established."

JulesA thank you so much! You have given me some wonderful information. Thank you also for making me feel comfortable in the questions I ask. I have always been very analytical and inqusitive and I tend to listen to personal experience rather then medical degree. I know some may not agree with that, though I believe like they say no one with MS is exactly the same and symptoms change, along with come and go.

I feel its time for me to give up and watch my health improve.

At the moment I am just hoping to gain a lot of information from others with MS because my newest Neurologist is now questioning if I have MS. Four lesions on the brain and he states it could be due to aging (Im 32) has left me rather frustrated.

Thank you again for the wonderful information and its great to talk with people that like to look deeper into things.

[Jules A]

Originally Posted by Undecided80

I have always been very analytical and inqusitive and I tend to listen to personal experience rather then medical degree. I know some may not agree with that, though I believe like they say no one with MS is exactly the same and symptoms change, along with come and go.

If you have an inquiring mind I'd encourage you to continue getting comfortable with doing some of your own research and being able to ferret out what constitutes valid sources. While I totally enjoy reading about personal real-life experiences there is also value in reputable studies. I also find I often learn something unexpected that I wasn’t even considering when I'm searching on a topic.

Google Scholar is our friend.

Sadly on message boards there can be a tendency to elevate someone who writes in an authoritative manner and my real interest lies in evaluating their sources and knowing their background before I crown someone an arm chair expert.

[Jules A]

Well as someone who is a former smoker and loved every puff I ever took this is a topic that I felt I had to address in my personal life. Yes it does seem as if smoking can possibly increase the chance of being diagnosed as well as the progression of multiple sclerosis. I was not able to reconcile taking a chance with something that might increase the damage this disease will do to me so I quit for the last time over 6 years ago.

In addition to what appears to be credible studies another reason I took such heed to the mumblings of the extra dangers of smoking for people with ms was a post I read on a ms message board. This member described going to a large MS convention and not being able to get close enough to use to the ash tray because of all the people in wheel chairs gathered around them. That image haunts me on several levels.

Google scholar resulted in over 46,000 hits for: smoking and multiple sclerosis
Note those parameters also included marijuana articles.

"These results support the hypothesis that cigarette smoking is associated with an increased risk of multiple sclerosis, and suggest that smoking may be a risk factor for transforming a relapsing–remitting clinical course into a secondary progressive course." from:
http://brain.oxfordjournals.org/content/128/6/1461.full