Bulging disks? No wonder he has so much pain. If you look at a picture of the spine and all the disks and such, you'll see that on each side of the opening in a vertebrae is where all the nerve bundles come through. With a bulging disk it can put pressure on those nerve bundles. I'm not sure if I'm explaining this adequately so if someone could give me a hand I'd appreciate it.

What does his doc say about these bulging disks and treatment for them?

I'm glad (I read through the entire thread before posting) you decided against it. It seems to me there might be some very serious risk involved. What jumped out at me is what would happen to these bulging disks if the wrong kind of pressure was put on them? Among other concerns. Is there risk of damage? I mean in addition to the problems Alan already has? Was that discussed at all?

Barbara

hey. L5S1, the usual.

not a doctor. im 30, did 20 treatments (mine was only 3K, 9 sounds like you could fly to calgary and get it done there for cheaper).

i went from 8/10 to 0/10 with the odd 4/10 flair up after working out and playing squash too muchh.

my email is ryanmitton@gmail.com

like many things in life, u will only get what you intend on getting.

i don't own a machine, and im not a doctor. worked like a charm....

Jarrett,

I totally and completely agree with you. I have been a "spiney" for a long time. Since there is stenosis and osteophytes there is NO WAY I would use traction. Forget the monies involved; it is a big scam in my opinion. Trust me, I have talked to my spinal PM a hundred times about conservative therapies like this; traction and even chiropractic and it is all hogwash. I was put in cervical traction once and it made me much worse. I thank God every day for the spinal group I eventually found. There are far better treatments for this than just traction. Think about the traction itself, just pulling on the lumbar spine. And when done, I can just visualize what it is doing or could do to the nerve roots. To me it is potentially dangerous and could potentially cause more problems than what is worth such as bowel and bladder issues. Sorry Melody, I don't mean to sound abrupt. But obviously Alan has two separate issues going on...the PN and the spinal disorders. I would NOT, NOT, NOT do the traction. I was just talking to a gal the other day that was doing lumbar traction and now she is much worse off. I simply wouldn't do it and I would find a good spinal PM, NS or OS. I know people are going to disagree with me. But considering Alan has stenosis and all kinds of spinal issues, I would not let anyone or anything manipulate my spine at all!

PainMD,

EXCELLENT point! Peripheral and central are two totally different beasts. AGAIN, two different and distinct processes!

Jarrett:

Don't worry, he's not having any kind of traction. Right now, he's getting a home infusion of gammaglobulin and as soon as the meds started to go into his body, the PN in his feet stopped. He just looked at the nurse and said "wow, this thing kicks in fast, doesn't it??" The nurse said "oh, yes, it does that from time to time. NOt with everybody but ocassionally, like for example, I have a patient with MS who could not see out of one eye, when I administered the home infusion, she was able to get vision back in that eye".

So sometimes, this IVIG thing works faster for some people than for others.

And as for anybody touching Alan's spine, you would not believe what I do for him when he lays down. I take my arm and press up and down pounding into his spine. He goes to heaven. Been doing this for 5 or so years.

I even showed the chiropractic/neurologist how I do this. This was during Alan's first appointmet wth Dr. Theil, his chiro/neurologist. Dr. Theil said "well, he obviously likes it and it makes him feel better so go for it".

I showed Dr. Theirl exactly what I do. Maybe I'm re-alligning his spine, I have no idea, but his PN got better (with Dr. Theirl and his adjustments) and my pounding on his back at night. I once got my friend Elaine, who is anorexic and weighed all of 80 lbs at the time.

Alan got down on the floor and she walked on his spine. Well, he was not only in heaven, he said "anytime you can get her to come over and walk on my back, go for it". Unfortunately she now has Stage 3 cancer and isn't walking on anyone's back but for a time, Alan loved it.

If I got on his back, I'd break it......lol
Maybe someday, when I'm nice and skinny.

We did tell Dr. Theirl about her walking on his back and Dr. Theirl said "no one should ever walk on anyone's back" but he did chuckle.

mel

Hey Mel,

I also was doing some independent research on the DRX 9000 and found this forum. I heard an advertisement for the machine on a local talk show here in Charlotte, NC and told my wife about it. She has been suffering from painful DDD for years and is at the point where she will try anything.

Here is the problem I have with the whole thing. The chiros who are buying this machine are all obviously going to a training class to sell the procedure. The initial consult was absolutely the same as everyone else has stated: "Let me see if you are a candidate", "how has this affected your life", your husband/spouse must be present when we decide if you will be accepted"... I am a salesman by profession and this is high pressure sales at its best! The chiro my wife went to even held her hand and said "I know how much you are suffering". His waiting room was filled with Christian books... I would presume that these guys are dropping a hundred grand or more for this machine and must charge these exorbitant prices to quickly earn their money back. The thing that concerns me most is that even if the machine has some real benefit, why all the smoke and mirrors and high pressure pitch to get you to sign on the dotted line. I just can't help but feel that these people are preying on people's misery. My wife is at her final review for acceptance meeting right now as I type and very angry that I did not go, but as I told her I do not need to sit and watch your eyes fill with tears as you are told this could be your cure and then have to sit and critique the whole thing and feel like a jerk. That is why the spouse is asked to come. The inversion table sounds like the best next course of action. Any feedback from anyone with DDD that has tried this would be great. Take care all.

You sound like a very caring and good hubby!!!

I hope your wife finds an end to her pain.

In my husband's case (and I consider him lucky) he has been told to exercise, he DOES IT!! and it helps.

But, he does not have an back pain. Never did. We just thought his neuropathy came from his back. About 6 doctors have now told us that IT'S NOT HIS BACK!!" I guess we have to listen to them, right??

People with back pain, well, how on earth can they exercise?? It must be excrutiating!!!!! I remember, years ago, when I had sciatica attacks.

If someone had told me to exercise, I think I would have EXERCISED them on their heads. My goodness, I couldn't even get out of bed and when I did get out of bed (just to go to the bathroom), I felt like my body weighed 2000 lbs. It was that hard to walk. But I went to a doctor and was told to do certain EXERCISES. Bend this way, bend that way. I thought she was nuts, but as I began to get better, I did the exercises.

I never stopped. And even though I have scoliosis, I still do the exercises. Maybe I'll stop when I'm 100. Who knows??


So now he's undergoing IVIG and we'll see where that leads us.

Take care and hopefully your wife will get some peace.
Hope it all works out.
Keep us informed okay?

Melody

Well, my wife came back and she is not currently speaking to me... Mel, if you don't mind me asking how did you address the sciatica pain? My wife has radiating pain into her leg from the nerve damage from the DDD. I am trying to get her to lose 20-25 lbs and start using the inversion table. Does that sound reasonable? It is so terrible to watch your spouse suffer. You seem like a very caring person. Thanks for starting this thread and responding so faithfully to people.

Okay: here's my response and you might think it comes across as too personal BUT I am a caring person and I say this with love.

Any excess weight on a person's body will do NO GOOD for sciatica. It just puts too much stress on the joints, the back, the core, EVERYTHING.

I once weighed close to 300 lbs. Years and years ago. What this extra weight did to my knees and my back, well forget it.

I had back pain most of my life and I was obese most of my life.
The First time sciatica pain hit me I thought i would die. It's that formidable. Went to the doctor and of course I got the "lose weight speech". I got mad at the doctor and said to myself 'who on earth is this skinny person telling me to lose weight"?? You see I wasn't alble or ready enough to face my obesity. I just wasn't. NO one could make me either. It had to come from me.

It had to be a lightbulb moment when you have such pain that you say: "what the hell am I doing to my body .' I used to self-medicate with food, with chips, dips, prezels, orange cupcakes (my favorite at the time)
I remember when my son left home when he was 20, I had a picnic that night. All the ding dongs, all all the milk, the party mix, the chex mix, and the thick potato chips with the dips. These are my triggers and I no longer keep them in my home. I know better. I went to a nutritionist who explained that FAT PEOPLE are not always hungry. You find the reason that a person eats all the time and you'll have a better understanding of why they are obese.

I love salads, fresh veggies, chicken cutlets (not fried), fish, (with creole seasoning). I do not eat after 7 p.m. I do not snack at night. I have learned portion control. I don't eat any sugar, nothing fried, I do stir fry though. I've learned to use Mrs. DAsh. You see what I had was a very bad habit (a habit I had to change).

When a person gets sick enough, gets scared enough and in my case, when I find out I had neuropathy, I never wanted another outbreak of the burning pain, the pins and needles, so I do everything I can do to keep my blood sugar normal. Also, it's kind of nice to wear nice clothes and no one looks at you when you go anywhere and they are thinking "look at that overweight person". I had that for many years.

It's all a mind thing. Something has to click in your wife's mind.
Be supportive, be understand, don't make fun of her and make sure she knows you love her. I dont' know exactly how much overweight she is carrying on her frame. But if it's over 35 to 40 lbs, it's a strain on her body. My friend's daughter is over 500 lbs. she's only 29 years old.
I know many overweight people who look at me and thing "oh you must thing you are hot stuff because you lost the weight. This is called jealousy. I've learned who my real friends are.

Just continut to gently support her. Is she amenable to your mentioning her being overweight??? I most certainly was not.

Only whe she is ready, will she lose the weight.

Write me any time and I'll tell you the foods i eat that they definitely take the weight off.


So good luck and say hi to your wife for me.

Sincerely, Melody

Mel - I'm new to this site, but I have to tell I am thankful for the information you have shared! My husband has back/neck problems; I was just diagnosed with degenerative disc problem in neck - I've been in pain for past 3 weeks, but with help of my Chiro - he has made the muscle spasm ease and with other treatments I don't fully understand, relieved the acute neck pain. Last night was the first night I slept in bed in a week. Doc used cold laser light to stimulate blood to inflamed area on my neck, did an adjustment with a 'thumper" instrument that looked like a gun - this did micro adjustment to vertebres and then the tinnes electrodes to make muscles relax. I feel better the next day, but 2 days afterward the pain starts creeping back. I also go to gym 4x a week - cardio and weight lifting. I have felt wonderful during the past year. Now suddenly this pain has occured and no I didn't lift inapproprately. I admit I have very poor sleeping posture and torqued my neck. Doc took xrays and said disc at base of neck was very thin and putting irritation on nerve going to R arm. Told me no more weight lifting with arms for next few weeks, but still go to gym, do low body weight lifting and lots of cardio. Hope Alan is feeling better. You have younger nieces, nephews? - maybe one of them could gently walk on Alan's back.

Mary

Hi Mary: So nice to be chatting with you. First of all, go to your local drug store and pick up a little jar of either Blue Stuff (or Blue emu), or an even smaller jar of TIGER BALM. Rub it on your neck, (you only have to use a little). It is GREAT for pain!!!

No, unfortunately we don't have any nieces or nephews. The only person he would let walk on him is my girlfriend who has anorexia and she is battling cancer so she's not walking on anybody's back any time soon. I make her laugh all the time. We can't talk about food because she's anorexic and believe me in her case, that's more deadly than the cancer but she still has a sense of humor. I keep telling her. "you have to beat this so we can go out and get our omelettes, and you can walk on Alan's back". You see, we used to go out to dinner and the only thing she'll eat is an swiss cheese egg omelette. That's her one meal of the day. We can't do that any more because she's so tired from the chemo, she won't eat anything and god forbid her weight goes over 100 lbs. Forget it. Her mother who is 83 can't take it anymore. Her children don't have anything to do with her either. She put them through too much. She was in and out of eating disorder clinics her whole life. It really does devastate a family. It's all depression.

Oh, I have a very funny story to tell you about lifting weights. I've mentioned it before but since you're new here you probably never read this before. It really is funny.

Some time ago (like 9 years), I decided to lose weight and go to the gym. My doctor was after me to shape up and I was finally ready to do it. When he weighed me I was 202 and he went crazy. Now I never looked like I weighed that, because my bones are very dense or something. I look 40 lbs less. So I said to myself, "I'll go to the gym, do the routines, and I'll watch everything that goes in my mouth and I'll lose weight". So that's what I did. I am diabetic so I cut out all carbs, ate only protein, and I went to the gym every day. AND I MEAN EVERY DAY. I did the weights. I went on the machines, I did the repetitions. I LOOKED GREAT. I had some BODY!!!

So a few months later, it was time for my medical checkup. I never weighed myself because I wanted to shock him and shock ME!!! So I went there wearing a pair of spandex shorts and a tank top. I never looked better in my life, believe me. I must have been 50 or 51. I looked good!!!

So I walked into his office, and he takes one look at me and goes "Oh my, look at you, you certainly have been working out and watching, hop on the scale lets' see what you weigh!!!!! I figured I lost 25 lbs and I'd see something like 175. Now if I weigh 175, I look like I weigh 135 because I"m very tall and big boned. Well, I hop on the scale and he goes nuts. He looks at me and says 'my god, what have you been eating??? The scale said 223. I will never forget that number if I live to be 100 years old. Ever see a woman cause a scene in a doctor's office??? Well, that was me, all those years ago. I said "the scale is broke, he says the scale is new". I said to him "Victor, how much do you weigh?? He's about 6 feet 2 inches, a very tall nicely built man. He said "I weigh 195". He gets on the scale. It reads 195. I made the nurses go on the scale, I made everybody in the waiting room go on the scale. I went out of my mind. All my dieting and going to the gym and I gained 22 lbs. I could not believe it.

I immediately went to my gym, went up to the biggest body builder I could find and I exclaimed "Can you please help me?' and this big hunk says to me "why sure little lady (LITTLE LADY!!!!!!), what can I do for you".

I said to him "you can tell me why I weigh 223 lbs?" He just stared at me and said "you weigh what???" are you serious"???. I said: "follow me.... and I got on the scale. He could not believe it. He calls all his body building buddies over and he calls all the trainers over and they are walking around me in a circle looking at my body. I was almost in tears. Finally, one of the trainers said to me "Melody, tell us exactly what you have been doing in this gym for 3 months?" I said "okay, and I showed him how I had been lifting weights every day for 3 months". BIG WEIGHTS. At least for a woman. 40 lb weights. AND I HAVE SCOLIOSIS by the way. And this was during the summer when it was hot outside and my arthritis didn't bother me during the summer". I LOVE IT WHEN IT'S 95 DEGREES OUTSIDE, I have no pain at all.

Well, when I told them what I was doing with the weights, I had 10 men laughing their heads off and I said "what the hell is so funny?" and they calmed down and said "you replaced your fat with muscle". You have been bodybuilding for 3 months. You have muscle mass". I responded "My doctor couldn't care less about muscle mass, he just wants me to lose weight".

They told me "don't worry, it's not fat, it's muscle". Now who on earth, as a woman wants to weigh 223 lbs. Well not me!!! So I immediately stopped the gym thing, and put the weight back on. I never picked up a weight again as long as I lived. Only 3 or so years ago, I began a way of eating (diabetic lifestyle, etc.) and walking and doing some cardio vascular stuff. I have never and I mean never picked up a weight again.

Now when I changed doctors in January, I would not go on the scale. I look perfectly fine but I told Dr. Fred the whole story about the weights. He laughed his head off and thank god he understood because he is also a body builder who is built like Arnold Schwartznegger. He also works out and meets up with my husband at the same gym they both go to. He told me "Melody don't worry, you can go on the scale, close your eyes, tell the nurse you don't want to know what you weigh and I won't tell you.

I haven't had to go to him medically yet. I always accompany Alan on his appointments so I got to know Dr. Fred through my husband. But when I have to go for anything, I know I won't have to look at the scale.

Only the people at Cornell (where I am in their diabetic protocol), they know what I weigh. I don't know and I don't want to know. I get weighed backwards and every time I go I lost maybe 2 or 3 lbs and they get all excited and they go "oh my god, you lost 2 lbs" and I think "you people have lost your mind, what the hell is 2 lbs".?

You see, it's not the two lbs. It's that I consistently lose 2 lbs every month. So it adds up.

I will never pick up another weight. It was explained to me that woman should do small weights with a lot of reps. I had done BIG weighs with a small amount of reps.

DUH!!!!!Maybe someday if I ever get down to 150, THEN I'LL DO SMALL WEIGHTS WITH A LOT OF REPS. I'm still scared to pick up a dumbell!!!

lol Melody