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Old 02-23-2008, 08:59 PM #1
Brian Brian is offline
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Hi Jaime & welcome to this forum.... another Victorian amongst here
You may like to check this out mate, http://www.ninds.nih.gov/disorders/p...neuropathy.htm

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Old 02-23-2008, 11:15 PM #2
shiney sue shiney sue is offline
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Default Jamie

Hi and welcome,
I saw your post and to be honest I
wanted Glen to step in first. We all
need a Glen in our life,there are many
bright people on this forum,many who
go though those painful tests.Glen explains
or puts it together,well let's say in a way
to make one understand..

Then we all move in for the attack. lol
I am a Diabetic have been for a long time.
Is that why I have PN well yes and no.
A lot of Neuro's get fixed on one issue
and say ah ha there you go,that's your
problem..Get a second opinion,after
many tests I have ployneuropathy's.
Spine,from feet to knees, hands tp elbows,
shoulder ,around to neck across back. And
in the tummy.

J. is going to come on and tell you to read
the stickes,please do she has told me at least
300 hundred times,but she doesn't get angry.Ha

Do I believe right here and now there's a cure,NO
do I think for my Children and any of there friend 's who may or
get PN in the future yes I do..But there is help and this
group can help,they know Drs.,they can tell you about tests.
and they can make you laugh,well I will stop befor I scare you off.
Many Blessings and Good luck Sue PS I am 61 but there are all ages
here..
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Old 02-24-2008, 07:50 AM #3
glenntaj glenntaj is offline
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Default If you're having symptoms all down the arm--

--shoulder to hand/fingers, in addition to getting worked up for some of the more systemic causes of neuropathy listed on the Liza Jane charts, you should get some MRI's of cervical spine and shoulder areas (if you haven't already).

There are two conditions known as Brachial Plexopathy and Thoracic Outlet Syndrome that involve compression of nerves that go from the body cavity near the spine and down the arms; depending on where the compression is one can get symptoms anywhere from shoulder to fingertips. We have a good forum for these here that you should look through:

http://neurotalk.psychcentral.com/forum24.html

And, of course, compression at cervical nerve roots can cause these symptoms as well.

There is also the "double crush phenomenon"--a systemic neuromorbid condition (like diabetes, or autoimmune vasculitis) doesn't by itself cause much in the way of symptoms, but add another insult, such as compression, and then you get them. (Almost anyone with a systemic neuropathy cause is more prone to compressive effects--the already damaged nerves are just more sensitive).

Are your symptoms in all areas similar? Do you hve the same "type" of pain? There's nociceptive (normal) pain, then there's nerve pain (burning, lancating, elctrical, stinging--just some of the words used for this hard to describe sensation), and you can get numbness, feelings of things (i.e., fabric) touching skin/sensations of wind/water when there's nothing there, vibrations--the whole gamut of what is referred to as parastheses (literally, sensations beyond the normal).
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Old 02-24-2008, 08:54 AM #4
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Lightbulb most of carpal tunnel

is metabolic in nature.

Low thyroid function deposits a substance under the tendons that pinches off the carpal and tarsal tunnels giving the symptoms.

Fluid retention can also cause this. I have found that P5P..a special B6 is very useful for this. Also one gets fluid retention with thiamine problems.
Thiamine 200-300mg a day may help. Or the newer Benfotiamine 150 - 300mg a day (which I switched to recently), is also good. It in fact seems better to me for this edema/fluid issue. Benfotiamine is a special form of thiamine, and also over the counter. You will most likely have to get it online, I have never seen it in stores.
It has just become more affordable too. I get mine at iherb.com

Also hormones will cause carpal tunnel. When I was pregnant I had a terrible time and lost both hands, and couldn't even sign my name. Much of it resolved after delivery, but it returned as just irritating.(instead of debilitating).
So if you take birth control pills or estrogen, you might see carpal tunnel.
This is rather like the pregnancy effects.

If you are gluten sensitive or have other food intolerances, you may see carpal tunnel effects too. Right now I am reacting to nightshades dramatically. (potatoes give me burning). Eliminating a suspected culprit... for 2 weeks and reintroducing it, and getting symptoms is the telling sign.
I would start with gluten first, since it is most common. Then move on to others if you don't react to gluten. Nightshades (tomato peppers potato), Lily family (garlic onion), Corn, dairy, soy are the most common others.

I think, along with some scientists that carpal tunnel is a symptom that something in your metabolic profile is not working right. I think you have to be a detective to target it.

Some other things: If you take drugs for your other issues, some of them may be depleting you of nutrients.
This might show up as carpal tunnel.
And also, eating MSG contain foods (monosodium glutamate) stimulates the nervous system in a negative way.
So check your labels. Restaurant food typically adds this heavily...so anything that tastes really good and seductive
when you eat out can be loaded with this additive. Soups especially or seasoned fries, etc.
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These forums are for mutual support and information sharing only. The forums are not a substitute for medical advice, diagnosis or treatment provided by a qualified health care provider. Always consult your doctor before trying anything you read here.

Last edited by mrsD; 02-24-2008 at 09:16 AM.
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Old 02-24-2008, 09:16 AM #5
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Mrs D, a question.
Does the surgical route always have to be taken
to cure/reduce CTS symptoms?
I've had CTS for years & its getting slowly, progressively worse.
My orthopedic surgeon has been giving me cortisone shots about once a year for the last 3 yrs, but he says it can get so bad that even surgery won't help.
(I'm staving off the surgery, for a number of different reasons - mostly cause I can't take the long 'down time' of not working during recuperation.)
But he's a surgeon. His job is cutting, that's what he likes to do.
(and gets a hefty chunk if income from doing)
The cortisone & P-5-P help a lot, but is there a non-surgical way
to reverse the progression? Supplements? Therapy? Anything?
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Old 02-24-2008, 09:24 AM #6
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So, now that we are on this subject--my friend Kev has numb fingers and has a hard time playing guitar anymore. He cant feel where his fingers are. Is there anything he can take that may help get some of that feeling back? He is a type 2 diabetic with neuropathy. He is taking 3000mcg of B12 daily, I did get him going on that.
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We urge all doctors to take time to listen to your patients.. don't "isolate" symptoms but look at the whole spectrum. If a patient tells you s/he feels as if s/he's falling apart and "nothing seems to be working properly", chances are s/he's right!
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Old 02-24-2008, 10:00 AM #7
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Lightbulb Bob...

You play string instruments...and this is hard on the hands. My son is already having troubles.

I would suggest you try the Benfotiamine... Since it came down drastically in price I can now afford it. (SAMe takes up alot of my budget in that respect).

It has been wonderful for me. I have always needed the thiamine. This is working better. I can have "pressure" palsies at times sleeping, and they have gone away. For best results I use 300mg a day. I've tried going back to 150, but over time I get some arm falling asleep at night.

You can try wearing the carpal tunnel braces at night when you are sleeping.
They work for me. When I garden alot, or use tools/sanding etc I get little flare ups and use the braces at night. They keep your hands in a position that does not pinch the nerve, so it can heal etc.

I have problems with salt, MSG etc too.

I had the "cortisone' shot during my pregnancy, on my right hand only. Since I was so impaired I could not function. It worked, and after I delivered I was good enough to go without further surgery thoughts about 3 days after my C-section. If I do any heavy work with rock, garden, or twisting of hands, I will get a flare up.

I think surgery should be a last resort. While it seems more accurate now with the lasers they use, it still can go wrong...and I am basically a surgical chicken!!
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Old 02-25-2008, 12:33 PM #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrsd View Post
You play string instruments...and this is hard on the hands. My son is already having troubles.

I would suggest you try the Benfotiamine... Since it came down drastically in price I can now afford it. (SAMe takes up alot of my budget in that respect).
.............I can have "pressure" palsies at times sleeping, and they have gone away. For best results I use 300mg a day. I
.........You can try wearing the carpal tunnel braces at night when you are sleeping.
They work for me.
Thanks for the info, Mrs D.
Yup, I've had to put the guitars on the 'back burner' for quite a while, now. Altho it is easier to play the classical acoustic one with nylon strings (Classical/Flamenco guitar style doesn't use picks), than the heavier tension of the steel stringed acoustic ones. Even with light tension strings. I don't have, or play electrics, with super-slinky xtra-light strings.
I've taken up the Clawhammer style banjo, lately (past 18+ mos). Lower tension strings and can be tuned down even lower. No picks are used. I'm considering an old time repro model with nylgut strings for even less tension. Any of them are much easier to play than my guitars. My left hand just doesn't have the grip or strength and my right gets numb and I lose/drop the pick.

I'll try the 300 mgs Benfotiamine. I do take 100 mgs of regular B1 (thiamine) daily, tho. Maybe a switch will help.

I do wear a brace every nite on my R wrist while sleeping, but still get the numbness/pain waking me up, and the L is starting to get a bit worse.
Any suggestions on brand (lowest cost, but still good quality) at iherb?
Thanks again,
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Old 02-24-2008, 10:14 PM #9
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Default

Thanks for the information. Quite an extensive and interesting list of possibilities. I'd never heard of any of these causes...
I've had wrist/hand pains & numbness for years, but never wanted to complain about it, (incase I lost my job at the time!) I just thought (and have been told by others) that carpal tunnel developes from repetitive work (RSI), and I know that I have done a lot of repetitive jobs for over 20 years, and also I write/type/sketch/paint and have other hobbies that put strain on the wrists and hands. I also now have arthritis in most joints, so I'm sure that doesn't help things...
I'll ask about some of these possible causes at my next appointment, but I'm sure my Neurologist will probably think I'm crazy! lol

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrsd View Post
is metabolic in nature.

Low thyroid function deposits a substance under the tendons that pinches off the carpal and tarsal tunnels giving the symptoms.

Fluid retention can also cause this. I have found that P5P..a special B6 is very useful for this. Also one gets fluid retention with thiamine problems.
Thiamine 200-300mg a day may help. Or the newer Benfotiamine 150 - 300mg a day (which I switched to recently), is also good. It in fact seems better to me for this edema/fluid issue. Benfotiamine is a special form of thiamine, and also over the counter. You will most likely have to get it online, I have never seen it in stores.
It has just become more affordable too. I get mine at iherb.com

Also hormones will cause carpal tunnel. When I was pregnant I had a terrible time and lost both hands, and couldn't even sign my name. Much of it resolved after delivery, but it returned as just irritating.(instead of debilitating).
So if you take birth control pills or estrogen, you might see carpal tunnel.
This is rather like the pregnancy effects.

If you are gluten sensitive or have other food intolerances, you may see carpal tunnel effects too. Right now I am reacting to nightshades dramatically. (potatoes give me burning). Eliminating a suspected culprit... for 2 weeks and reintroducing it, and getting symptoms is the telling sign.
I would start with gluten first, since it is most common. Then move on to others if you don't react to gluten. Nightshades (tomato peppers potato), Lily family (garlic onion), Corn, dairy, soy are the most common others.

I think, along with some scientists that carpal tunnel is a symptom that something in your metabolic profile is not working right. I think you have to be a detective to target it.

Some other things: If you take drugs for your other issues, some of them may be depleting you of nutrients.
This might show up as carpal tunnel.
And also, eating MSG contain foods (monosodium glutamate) stimulates the nervous system in a negative way.
So check your labels. Restaurant food typically adds this heavily...so anything that tastes really good and seductive
when you eat out can be loaded with this additive. Soups especially or seasoned fries, etc.
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Old 02-25-2008, 12:09 PM #10
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If it is CTS, you'll be best off getting a referral
from your neuro to an orthopedic doc.
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