Hi Mel, the part I can't understand is why does his feet feel better [ although only temporary ] I know, but still he still feels relief after seeing the chiro/ neuro, just doesn't add up in my mind.

Brian:

I just showed Alan your posting. He said to tell you:

When Dr. Theirl uses a G5 machine on his back, he concentrates on the L5 and L4 and the Glutes and towards the hip. Dr. Theirl feels this is where Alan's problems seem to lie. A lot of muscles in the body do not get used. Alan says that Dr. Theirl told him that when he uses the G5 machine on Alan, it activates the underlying muscles that have never been used. It causes tremendous circulation of blood down to the feet. It takes ALL THE TINGLING AWAY AND ALL THE BURNING. So ten minutes of a G5 machine and you are in heaven. Alan says he has no pain the rest of the afternoon after leaving Dr. Theirl's office.

This may not work on anyone else because of the various types of neuropathy. Dr. Theirl feels it's his back. The back doctor says no.

So what can we do??

This is enough to drive one crazy.

lol

Melody

I know what I would do, without question go to Dr. Theirl, he has proven to be able to help Alan, were as the neurosurgeon sounds like he is a bit jealous that the neuro/chiropractor knows how to treat him.
I know there is a few neuro/chiroprators in my state, perhaps I should ring them up and tell them that there is no such thing. , some docs really make you laugh, reminds me of a professor of neurology that I saw when I first got PN, going by a nerve conduction test " I had no signs of peripheral neuropathy "
this is what he wrote back to my gp, the goose didn't even know how to test for small fibre neuropathy, once I got see a decent neuro he got real angry when he read this other neuro's report, and said who is the idiot that wrote this, I told him and he said " oh him " and just through the report accross his desk as you would with crap.
I have found that some doc's are really terrific and others think they are, say no more

--but there are neurological chiropractors, such as Dr. T. (They even have a professional association.) This may have been just a little professional nitpicking--people in the medical professions are very sensitive about titles, especially in the Internet age when many feel their status as purveyors of specialized, esoteric knowledge is eroding.

Now, as far as Alan goes, of course he's been through this for quite a while now, and of course to this point there's been no definitive "smoking gun"--unfortunately the case for many. The evidence as to the etiology of his neuropathy has been mostly circumstanital/anecdotal, simply because the medical technology/knowledge is as of yet insufficiently advanced in this area.

Still, I suspect there may be multiple factors contributing to his symptoms. He may have some sort of low level autoimmunity going on, that has not been documentable--though I'd love to see the results of one of Cornell Weill's ganglioside agglutinin tests on him (the only test of autoimmunity that ever came up even slightly positive on me--it's a gross test of autoantibody activity). The fact that he has psoraisis certainly leads to the suspicion that autoimmune factors may be a part of this--people seldom have just one autoimmune condition. (And Ashkenazic Jews are rather prone to autoimmune syndromes--just ask them. )

But, there may be other factors going on here that compound the symptoms--including compressive effects, possibly from the spine (MRI's are not always accurate at noticing minor impingment of nerve roots--none of his reports have ever mentioned foraminal narrowing, have they?). Small degenerations of the spine are common is all of us as we age, and are not always heavily symptomatic--hey, I'm full of disc bulges, oesteophytic complexes, etc., that occassionally increase my symptoms, especially in certain positions. Pressure may even be coming from lower down in his legs or feet. The ankle is a common area of nerve entrapement/compression, as is the knee--and this can even be caused by muscular overdevelopment in athletes (so called compartment syndrome). It may be that Dr. T's treaments help to releive such pressure for short periods of time and that's enough to mitigate the symptoms. (You may remember we discussed the double-crush hyporthesis--the idea that two "minor" compromised to a nerve along its length produces a symptomatic effects that is greater than the presumed sum of their parts. people with neuropathies form one cause are far more prone to even small compressive effects on their nerves than normals.)

It also occurred to me that Alan's symptoms may be contributed to by some degree of peripheral artery/capillary compromise (he does have a history of heart/circulation issues) so that his symptoms may fluctuate depending on how well his circulation is working to his legs/feet--and Dr. T's theory of loosening muscles to take some of the pressure off of those vessels could certainly fit in with that idea.

In any case, you can certainly pursue further opinions--and I know you'll always bring Alan's full medical history with you to any of those. It's entirely possible, though, that the "a-ha" moment will never occur. (It hasn't for me, though we have our suspicions.)

Mel,
If it were me, I'd get off the 'cause' kick. It does nothing more than cause (no pun intended) anxiety and stress, which is not good for PN- that's proven!
Do what makes you (Alan) feel better and live with it.
Get on with your lives and try to live as normal a life as possible.
Concentrate on the things you can try to do something about (healing the foot).
Believe me, once the 'acceptance' mode kicks in, you'll both be better off.
Never be complacent, always be aware of new and better ways to diagnose, but stop going ga-ga nutso about finding the cause. Your posts seem to be highly detailed, and anxiety ridden- whether its you or Alan. Let it lie.
Just MHO.

Melody so sorry about all the roller coaster information you are getting from your doctors, sounds like the doctors are not sure what is causing Alan's neuropathy. I know that we like to know what is causing it so that we can stop it from doing more damage, but for some reason many people just don't get the answers, but thumbs up for you and Alan for continuing to try.

Glad to hear that Alan does get some relief with the Chiro.even though it is temporary. Those temporary relief is what gives us hope and maybe some normal life can come back.

Trish

Thanks Trish for your kind comments.

Each day I give Alan a full body massage. He says "all the blood seems to go into my feet and all the pain goes away".

Some days are better than others. The weather has an affect on his neuropathy also.

And this morning he went to bed at 7 a.m. and he was jumping around in the bed saying "oh my god, my neuropathy is killing me".

I just massaged him, he went off to sleep, I got up and went out for breakfast. He seems to sleep better during the early daytime (as to many others who have neuropathy)

It's not a one size fits all syndrome, is it?

I hope you are having a good day hon.

And thanks again.

Melody

Bob:

You wrote:

"Your posts seem to be highly detailed, and anxiety ridden- whether its you or Alan."

Sorry if my posts are detailed. I thought that is the purpose of these threads, ...to share info and get some answers.

And it wasn't OUR IDEA to go to the back doctor. It was HIS NEUROLOGIST's idea. She made the appointment. Alan and I felt we had to go because his neuro said "I believe it's your back that is causing the neuropathy".

And I can assure you that neither of us is angst ridden. We go about our business each and every day and make each other laugh. You only have to read some of my posts to realize this.

And we attend the Neuropathy Support groups as often as we can. I bake muffins and everyone seems to enjoy them.

I am not the kind of person who goes around with a pessimistic kind of attitude (althought I certainly am entitled to do so due to the fact that we have a son who is no longer in our lives. That is enough to make anyone ANGST RIDDEN.

But I digress.

No more detailed reports, I can assure you of that.

Melody