Serious question. You don't have to answer it.
 

1 Long ago I was hospitalized in a weird set of circumstances (as it is most times probably) over a holiday weekend which was was about 4 or 5 nights.
That was life altering.

2. Around that time, I had two or three bad enough encounters with cops.
These also changed my world view in terms of how I handle myself outside the cloister I have built for myself.

Am I the only one here who thinks like this: . . . . that there are many moments in any given week when one could be on the wrong side of a cop's temperament or
involved in a scene that has a cop or someone else transporting one to a mental hospital or to jail?

===
In my childhood, I played piano/organ at a state hospital very near my house. And a childhood best friend's father was a pdoc there.
One might think that I have some ease with institutions.
Not really. The power of the state can be massive.

In my thirty years in this area, I have lived near another huge state hospital -- mostly home to schizophrenics (medium term) and
people with addiction problems ( 72-hour holds).
At her request, I once drove someone to a hospital and waited with her until morning when the pdoc showed up to let her through the locked doors.

I have never been inside a jail and yet I often feel like I have to hold everything together in order to be within the lines of acceptable behavior.

In other words, I spend a H U G E amount of energy trying to "pass" as normal
knowing that at any given moment I could freak out and scare people.

M

speaking from experience as one who was in and out of pshch wardst after my acquired brain injury nearly drove me insane I can actually say the police overwhelmingly did not want confrontation. One time my mother called the police on Me and five of them came and I said oh well I guess we r going 2 have to dance aren't we which meant fight. And the cops did nothing and they said they would not fight. And they waited until I got composed and I left it on my own. You fit in fine. it will be fine I promise

Mari,

I think the fact that you even think to expend that energy puts you in a safer place than you realize. And you'd probably be safe even if you turned down the energy to just a bit cautious. OR only turned it on when you feel particularly upset. People do not get hospitalized for breaking down and crying, or screaming at someone else in line. Unless you physically assaulted someone... like enough to hurt them badly, it's unlikely you'd end up in jail or a hospital, as I see it.

The times I've been possibly in danger of being put in jail are all times when I wasn't in the least worried about it... eg reckless driving, drinking and driving. Both behaviors endanger others (and self). Cops will protect others by removing you from the streets, and in those situations, they will use force if you become belligerent because they cannot allow you to persist in those kinds of behaviors.

And the fact remains, if people worried or even had a second thought that they would end up in jail or in a hospital, they would not do that kind of stuff. I did not worry about it -- probably like most who do those things or other dumb, dangerous crap.

waves

Certainly enough to make one very fearful and willing to put forth enormous effort to avoid a repeat.

Well, I don't know what happened, but I'll say this. Cops are trained to come off tough. They need to be assertive. It is their job to bark up a storm specifically to avoid biting. The fact that yoou weere scared shows that you are not a criminal, LOL.

This is certainly possible, but I don't think it's healthy to worry about it or take steps to prevent it any more than we worry about, say, being in a car accident, or being assaulted. Taking reasonable precautions is ok, but the bottom line is that it isn't something you control: it's about somebody else behaving badly.

waves

Mark,
I am sorry that you have been through that. You have a good head on your shoulders.

M

if I had a good head on my shoulder I wouldn't have had challenged the cops to a fight lol. I think you will be fine. Sometimes I think I'm acting strange and maybe peoples are looking at me but I realize it's only in my head and I am acting just like everyone else.

Few of them are properly trained in how to handle mental health issues and I have no doubt that our jails (w/ the largest jailed population in the world) are crammed full of the MI.

Of course I am not a criminal. I do not break laws.

But many times when I am at work or out in public I am holding every thing together --- feeling like an imposter--- could lose it completely,

My anxiety is so strong and barely medicated that I could easily let go
Of what holds me back.
Somedays almost every minute of my work days feels one half second away from revealing that I am crazy. I have developed coping/ covering mechanisms of course.

Mark,

Maybe people are mostly paying attention to themselves.

Still , once one is confined, things do not improve with
Out some outside intervention.

I carry legal insurance ( with the phone number on my key chain) in case I need representation.


M

I am sorry you live with this fear, Mari. It sounds like you are afraid of a dam bursting.

I think you are in less danger of being put away than your fear would have you believe, even with untrained cops and whatnot. But only you know what is behind that dam. I do not.

I also understand that fear isn't rational and cannot be convinced. I am glad you have figured out coping mechanisms. Theoretically, we get better and better at coping as we get older.

waves

I understand your fear.
I too am afraid that I will do something wrong. I do not have your level of fear though, am sorry that you do.
I am afraid of cops. always have been. scares me to death of being pulled over like I am paranoid that I have done something wrong and will be sent to jail. I feel that I am a good driver but still have those fears.
I have drank and driven before but don't do that anymore.
I always try to act normal around my psychiatrist because of her power over me. even if I am hypomanic I will try to cover that up as I don't want to ever go to the hospital again.Horrible place. But necessary if psychotic like I was.
I don't remember the first and only time when I was first diagnosed the exact circumstances but the police were called and I was hand cuffed and taken to the psych hospital, there I was put into 4 way restraints, it was awful but necessary, I guess. I will take my meds forever.
bizi

I can say with certainty, that your fears are going to drive how you react.
But I too feel you are in no danger. Not saying it exactly right.

I have been on the side of trying to get my adult sons help. And its not
easy to even get them seen if they don't agree.

So I am having a hard time understanding the cops. In my area, for
some reason its hard to get a cop to come to help. And with our
juveniles, when a parent can still supposedly get them help.

I have many cases in the past that the cops wouldn't help transport
the child for us.

Donna :hug::grouphug:

Hi Mari. I believe that you have some type of phobia,and that this is a irrational thought that you don't have to worry about. I don't think that you would loose your mind,but that you may have a period of being more upset then usual. You will be fine.

I went through a period of time where I thought that I would have a panic attack,and that the people behind me would see my head start to shake. I didn't want to go anywhere unless I could sit in the back row where people could not see me shake. It was some sort of fear of being shamed,or something. It started at that Military School when I had a panic attack when we were all sitting at attention. It was some sort of phobia,and this phobia was on my mind allot.

I had a fear of loosing control in some way around people,and that they would not understand what was happening to me. I'd loose my voice sometimes,and have a small panic attack,and then it would go away. I would think about it as a very embarrassing situation,but I didn't loose control,but I'd be obsessed about what they though of me. This was a huge distortion,and obsession in my mind.

Got to go. Lightening just struck near by. BF:hug::hug::hug:

The lightning has left the area. A group of thunderstorms went over.

I had feelings like I was going to loose control years ago. I felt like I was about to explode,but I don't feel that anymore. I'd felt emotion surge through me,but I didn't feel violent. I just felt like I could explode,or loose control,or freak out. I felt these feelings like electricity would jolt through me. All of those things are unpleasant. BF:hug::hug::hug:

I am glad the weather has calmed down for you, Steve.

I've had similar states to those. I don't guess I have as much baseline anxiety. I think that makes it worse.

I've felt like I couldn't hold it together before, but was not worrying about consequences like pollice or hospitals. Was just trying to get from moment A to moment B. I had a level of agitation and reactivity and my sense of reality was maybe a little off... mostly felt everything very intensely.

Fortunately these states are just "states" for me. At most there will be bad times of weeks or months, where these states occur repeatedly, or last longer. But it isn't a constant, chronic thing I deal with.

I must say, Zyprexa helped tremendously with those states, but it was not sustainable in the long term.

I can't really imagine having that somehow tied up in a fear about what would happen if I did break down. I mean, I can only imagine that it is a hundred times worse. I think at most I've worried about getting fired over outbursts at work. I ususally felt bad enough at those times that I didn't much care about getting fired. Mostly just cared about holding it together for the sake of it. I think it's a whole other level if one feels threatened (hospital and jail are big threats to feel).

waves

Mari I'm sitting here thinking about what to say. I'm so sorry that you feel this amount of fear.

If there is a situation where a policeman is in a bad mood,and you are not feeling well,and your paths cross at a bad time,or situation,things would probably work out ok.

I have scanners,and have monitored police over decades,and they have many rules to follow. You have many rights. They have to have a probable cause to check you out for anything.

(Constitution 4th Amendment) The right of the people to be secure in their persons,houses,papers,and effects,against unreasonable searches,and seizures,shall not be violated,and no Warrents shall issue,but upon probable cause,supported by Oath or affirmation,and particularly describing the place to be searched,and the persons or things to be seized. That's just one amendment.

I don't think that it's a crime to be freaked out by the police. A magistrate,or judge would probably look though the records,and clearly see that a person has anxiety problems. This probably happens around America all of the time. Anxiety is not a crime around the police,or anyone else.

I'm uncomfortable around the police,but I've helped them in the past to catch some bad guys. That's who they are after,and those bad guys are bad to the bone.

The police are out there maintaining the peace of the public. They are cruising in cars to keep order,and bring in the(((bad guys))).

The people that are coming into schools with M-16s,and AK-47s are the dangerous mental cases(10-96s)that they are concerned about. They are dangerous to society.

I have come across a few truly crazy people,and you are not one of them.

I have had two people pull guns on me. One of them were dangerous,and drunk,and was not from America. The other one was clearly in the wrong. A friends brother pulled a knife on me,and he was psychotic. I didn't call the police on them. I've crossed the paths of some dangerous people. One was from prison,and a bounch of us tried to help him,but he was to far gone.

I hope that I said something that comforts you. BF:hug::hug::hug:

I am not explaining myself well.

Those of you who have been in jail or had a family member in jail or been in a mental hospital or visited someone in a mental hospital or had a family member call you from a mental hospital have somewhat of an idea of what I am talking about.
How about having two brothers who worked in mental hospitals or therapy camps for MI teenagers?
Or how about getting a call from a social worker about a cousin in a hospital who was trying to place the cousin for after care? That particular cousin had been locked up in a hospital for one year with bipolar.


Apparently I am also not explaining the degree of my anxiety and how with that high level of anxiety I have to go to work and deal with people.
I have to perform on the job while at the same time not calling attention to myself. This is impossible.

Maybe only I have had a colleague hauled away to the hospital after being manic. She was fired / quit / got sicker shortly after.
Eight years later her sister called me to tell me that the colleague was found dead.

Maybe no one except me has heard a shootout, fallen to the floor to dodge bullets, and listened to the cop outside tell the apparently bleeding victim that he would call the ambulance after the guy gave up the name of his partner in the attempted robbery.

I might be the only one who after falling asleep while driving in heavy traffic on a hot day with no a/c in the car got into an an emergency lane to get off at the next exit and got stopped by a cop.
That cop threatened to take me to jail right on the spot unless I got back on the road and and into my lane.
When I tried to explain, things got much worse.

Perhaps I am the only one here who had someone hit her car on the way to work and rushed to get away
even though witnesses told me afterwards that it was not my fault.
I had no drivers license or insurance card with because the mental hospital had not returned it to me when I was collecting my stuff to leave after my stay. (I called the chief of psychiatry to get my stuff back.)
I drove that car for another five years with a completely dented and smashed u before I could get cash to have it fixed or get credit to buy a new car.


I accept that most people do not have experience with these things.
It feels like part of my life even though at this time I am not locked up.

I apologize.

Bizi,
Lots of hugs.

I was also put in five point restraints, given an injection, and watched while in a "quiet room" for some time.
It worked to make me compliant for the rest of my stay.

M

Mary I'm sorry. You have been through allot of dangerous,and unfair things. I'm so sorry. BF:confused::Sigh::hug::hug::hug:

mari,

I have been in jail once and in psych wards too many times lol. I have had the four point restraints and the quiet room I have done the hit and run thing too many times when I was younger. I had a friend who after asking me for Xanax and me telling him no, killed himself with Xanax the next week. I felt guilty for years for not calling his mother and letting her know he was in danger. I was dragged by police to jail for dwi even though I had drunk one beer and in the end they had to let me go after taking breathalyzer at precinct. I have looked around at work and wondered if they knew how anxious I felt. it is hard. but brokenfriend is right. the police for the most part are on our side. and being anxious or depressed or bipolar is not a crime. it is hard, but I try my best to put all of those things that happened behind me or they would drive me crazy. we both need to focus on the present and the good things in our lives like our friends on this board.
mark

Hi, Steve, :hug: :hug: :hug:

We all have.

Mari

Hi, Mark,

Thanks

Keep doing what your are doing now to keep yourself together.

M

Everything stinks.

It almost feels like too much to work so hard and still be messed up.

http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/s...shocked010.gif
M

Hi Mari
 

Hi Mari,
Just from knowing you on the internet, I don't think you are crazy at all. In fact you know yourself pretty good! Most cops do not take you to jail for crying, or even being hysterical. Only if you represent a danger to others or to yourself. We all just hang on to ourselves at times. I am bi polar too, and have had an encounter with a cop at a very bad time in my life. He was wonderful to me, and helped to settle me down. I didn't go to the lock up, psych ward or jail. He just hugged me. I tend to believe that in a crisis, most cops are going to try to do the right thing.
You are a kind and loving person in any light. ginnie:grouphug:

I guess I was not supposed to try to answer, since I have not been shot at, locked up, or been involved with cops restraining self or dear ones multiple times, much less people dying.

I am really, really sorry you have had this kind of repeated trauma.

I found myself trying very hard to reconcile being truthful about my take on things and saying something helpful. There may not be anything helpful to you in my truthful bucket. I was going to tell you about a really good experience I had with a cop, but it seems useless somehow. :(

I am not even sure what I can realistically say to be comforting.

I am sorry. This is a hard/emotional topic for you. You said we did not have to answer, and in fact I am going to stop now. I have nothing useful to say. I feel like I should apologize for trying, but that would be stupid.

I do care about you, and I tried because I care. So maybe just take home message that I care, and wish you well.

waves

I am sorry, Mari. :(

http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-hug008.gif


:heartthrob::Heart::heartthrob:

Thank you for sharing mari, the past traumas that we have experienced are hard to forget.
I hope that some how rehashing them was cathartic for you. Place them on back burner for now.
I am sorry it all feels so overwhelming.
You are a strong woman.
Know that...look what you have endured.
sleep today.
((((((HUGS)))))
bizi
ps. can't remember if your tdoc helps you these days? Maybe time for a visit if you think she could help you feel more centered/grounded?

Bizi,

During our last session, tdoc picked up the phone to call 911.
I told her, "NO"


That was in May or Jun 2013.
She called a few times after that to try to schedule another appt.
I put her off.
She stopped calling.

M

Waves,

I take that message. Thank you.

You are right.
If I hear another story about good cops, I will puke.
The younger of my two brothers (the one with un-dx'ed bipolar) did felony jail time for selling drugs.


M

calling 911 was not helpful:mad:
can't remember if you are close to your sister?
If you are maybe reaching out to her might help?
Hubby can only do so much with what he carries daily....
bizi

Mari

I personally am glad you shared everything. I had no clue it was such
a bad situation.

I have a son who was a juvenile in jail. And in a school for boys that
he felt was a jail. Mainly in the beginning because he was maniac.
He also has a fear of jails, and cops.

Donna :hug::grouphug:

Mari Have you thought about possibly applying for Social Security Disability. It sounds like you are fighting a horrible battle for your life.

Words cannot describe this kind of battle. I have a different type of thing,but I know what it's like being at my wits end. BF:hug::hug::hug:

Steve,

I have thought about it.
But I do not qualify.

M

I'm sorry Mari. BF:hug::hug::hug:

Mari,
I think you have explained yourself well.
It sounds so very very hard.

I have mentioned my relative with bipolar disorder. I avoid saying who she is in relation to me, simply because there is always a small chance someone might recognize me via my words here on line (I actually had that happen to me on another site! It was WEIRD!:eek:)
In our case, she doesn't work and is on disability. I can't really see her working, with the possible exception of a very part time job. In fact, I do hope that eventually she can work a part time job, as she could use the income and it would be good for her self esteem.
However, the times she has had a part time job in the past, she has had heavy duty problems with other people.
One time in particular, was horrible. Someone at work said something very unkind to her (as people can do) and she reacted both verbally and physically.
Well, like we all know (or really should know) right or wrong, it almost doesn't matter what Gawd awful thing the person said originally, once you react in that BIG way, it all comes down on you and it usually is all over.

I recall her psychologist telling me that it takes energy for her to hold it all in (for lack of better words here) each and every day.
When not working, she seems to do fairly well, she just didn't/doesn't have the energy to take it that one big step further.
I do think if she had a good therapist, it might help her....hard to say.

I met a very successful physician that through a odd set of circumstances, I found out has bipolar disorder. I have seen her in action. Other than an occasional bit of moodiness, she is doing very well.
So, even though it has to be very very hard, I know, depending on the individual (of course) and the support system, much can be achieved.
So, I feel badly that my relative is limited, but I understand that we are all individuals. I am glad when I see her stable and happy.

It is good that you have that insurance...may you never have to use it.
I think to a large extent, I do understand what you are saying. It is good to know that disability is always a possibility ....* if your condition worsens, of if you have a second illness (for sure)...no doubt an attorney can make this happen for you.

BTW, we had a very weird experience recently where something was stolen and the police were called. Our neighbor, who is very shy, tried to speak with the police, but must of had a panic attack or something (not sure) and no words would come out of his mouth. Later, perhaps when he felt better, when he approached the police again to tell them something (it was actually kind of important) their first reaction to him was very rude and shockingly unkind. I had NO idea what had happened! I know it was an odd situation, but they seem to over react. It was sooooo strange and although they were very nice to me....it did make me wonder why they reacted rather harshly to my neighbor assuming the worse (that he was a prankster or something??? no idea)

Your posts have been a real learning experience for me...an insight into bipolar disorder. I hope you are having a good day. (hugs)
Thank you.

wow Mari

I have spent my whole life scared that my behaviour or actions will get me either arrested or sectioned.............hence why i cry a lot and steer clear of any situation that might cause my fear to become a reality

today i could have committed murder [figueritively speaking]

home now ..and a dark room

David

ps my brother was a policeman.....feared also that my behaviour would affect his role....tar/brush...theory

hi david,
HOpe you are alright.
((((HUGS))))
bizi

My fear is that I could be put to shame,or shamed. I fear being talked about,and things like that. I have a phobia of coming to complete ruin. My family says that they will not let that happen. I spend most of my time in my apartment these days. I seem to be exhausted all of the time.

I just had a nightmare before I came in here. I don't think that I could hurt anyone. I have self control,and don't want anyone to be hurt. I've been pushed pretty hard by some people,but I'm not aggressive. I never have been,but have trained for self defense.


I have a fear of someone,or ones breaking down my door in a home invasion,and them coming into my apartment. I have cameras looking out in different places so I can see whats going on out there day,and night. I know that sounds weird. I even have dash cams in my car. They are small,and not very apparent. Those dash cams are set to record,and are. At a later time I format them,and continue to record when I'm driving. BF:hug::grouphug::hug:

I guess that I have a strong will to survive all of this. I feel a strong desire to live,even though it's not really that much fun,it's not easy,and it's like a mission. I want to fulfill this mission and survive.

I want to survive today,tomorrow,and on,and on. Does anyone else feel this type of thing? BF:hug::hug::hug:

I too spend a lot of time in the living room in the dark. mostly because it relieves the symptoms of my head injury but lately it might be depression also.

Unfortunately, I have had risky behavior my whole life, maybe due to the BP2

Have been in psych wards and jail.

Walked in on skinny guy robbing my house and beat the heck out of him 12 years ago.

But now with head injury, I feel vulnerable. Scared for the first time in my life.

I am sorry for those of you who feel it. It is a bad feeling. And I don't like it.

If I walked in on someone robbing my house now I would be terrified.

survival and more. we are our own heroes
 

Yes, Steve, :Bow: http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-music035.gif

We are extraordinary people. http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-score010.gif
We battle for health care.
We battle to accept our conditions.
We come to peace with our days. http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-chores003.gif

I have met strong people here.:grouphug::grouphug::grouphug:

M

Mark, http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-sleep013.gif

I think time helps.

THink of it like a sport or any other skill.
When you do an activity repeatedly, you gain muscle memory.

Learning to get through the days is similar.
Each day can help with with the next. There is a pattern to survival.

I have not tried to comprehend what to do if someone were robbing my house.

I want to live. I have some expectation that the universe provides for my fundamental wants and needs.
It sounds nuts but it has provided for me so far.

Google: Weighted Blankets.
They provide some sensory deprivation -- the same thing you are looking for in the darkness.
They were developed for autistic children.
They work for adults as well:
http://www.mosaicweightedblankets.com/benefits/

https://www.sensorygoods.com/SearchR...eVkhoCZ0Pw_wcB

M