Some Research Finds Over 70% Of People With MS Have Cpn Infection
 

Ongoing research by Doctor Stratton of Vanderbilt University has found over 70% of MS patients were infected with the bacterial infection Chlamydia Pneumoniae (Cpn). Not to be confused with the STD.

UK microbiologist Dr David Wheldon has researched Stratton's antibiotic protocol that was created to rid Cpn. Wheldon's wife has SPMS and has been on this protocol for over 2 years. Since being on this Combined Antibiotic Protocol (CAP), her MS has since gone into remission.

I quote from Sarah Wheldon:
http://www.avenues-of-sight.com/Sara...MSpages-2.html

Cpn is a lung infection spread by coughs and sneezes. With some people, because of genetic reasons, this bug in it's spore Elementary Body (EB) form goes past the lungs and enters the blood supply where it is carried, piggyback riding on red blood cells, looking for other cells in the body to infect.

Once it finds a cell it likes, which could be an immune system microphage cell, a muscle, skin, heart, liver, thyroid, brain (it has the capacity to bridge the blood-brain barrier) etc - it enters this cell and change to the intracellular Reticular Body (RB) form. In this form it acts like a parasite, parasitically stealing energy from the cell, by using the cell's mitrochrondria (cell energy factory), it grows and reproduces creating more EB's that it throws out the cell. As the cell is depleted in ATP energy which is created by the mitrochrondria, the cell does not have enough energy to do the job it is programmed to do, giving rise to the fatigue that many people who have MS and other illnesses that Cpn is implicated in.

The Cpn bug is very good at hiding from your immune system. If it detects a threat to it's existence, like antibiotics, it simply converts to it's 3rd form, called the cryptic hibernation form which is also intracellular. In this form, it still continues to steal the cell's energy.

Because it can hide from the immune system very easily (remember, it also infects immune system cells meaning that they are unable to do their job properly), this accounts for the very varied detection rate of this bug in the testing labs.

Dr Stratton has designed a patent for Cpn testing and treatment. Dr David Wheldon also has a protocol based on Stratton's patent. This CAP consists of taking 3 different antibiotics together alongside a supplement called NAC. The reason for taking so many antibiotics, is because each one works for the different stages of the bug, including the cryptic hibernation form.

Cpn can be eliminated, but it does take a long time to eliminate it completely. The protocol can last 2-5 years, with a steady improvement of symptoms. Usually people notice the improvements increase the greatest after a year of being on the CAP.

Bear in mind that all of the above information is very cutting edge, and is mostly unknown by most of the medical establishment. Stratton's research lab at Vanderbilt University, Nashville, Tennessee has recently been given further funding. He is to look into the links between Cpn and many chronic illnesses.

He found Cpn infection in 100% of patients with Chronic Fatigue Syndrome using his patented diagnostic test. There are also links with Alzheimers, Asthma, Rheumatoid Arthritis and many other illnesses. In the control sample studies of healthy people, he found 18-20% Cpn infection, which goes to show how wide spread this bug is.

I am simply putting this information in this forum to point people into a different direction for their own research into their illness. I was pointed into the direction of Cpn, when my partner, who has been bedridden for over 2 years with severe M.E/CFS, was diagnosed with Cpn. She has been on the Wheldon/Stratton CAP since late last year and is showing early, but small improvement in her symptoms.



Mark Hall

Sorry, I forgot to mention - the "CAP" mentioned above stands for Combined Antibiotic Protocol.

Thanks,

Mark

If MS goes into permanent remission from ABX therapy, then it is my opinion, and that of my well respected neurologist, that one never really had an MS diagnosis.

I find it hard to believe that 70% of all people with MS have been infected with bacterial chlamydia. I think this has been skewed research data to support Dr. Wheldon's theory. What's the base population from which this data is gathered? 70% of all the people in the world?

It is not widely accepted in the medical community nor accepted by neurologists in general. It is Dr. Wheldon's theory alone. There are no clinical research data to back this up.

Thanks for the information once again Mr Hall. We have all seen this before. Dr. Weldon and his antibiotic cure for MS. :(

Last week I posted a link saying Chlamydia Pneumoniae (Cpn) infection play a role in the pathogenesis or symptoms of some patients with Chronic Fatigue Syndrome, Fibromyalgia Syndrome, and other unexplained illnesses?


http://www.immunesupport.com/library...le.cfm/ID/7938

Hi,

Unfortunately as I haven't posted enough yet, I am not allowed to provide any web links.

The Stratton study found 73% of MS infected with CPn and the control samples were 23%. Other labs disagreed, but there is a lot of controversy with diagnostic tests of this bug using PCR. That is why Stratton created his patent.

I understand that this subject is very controversial, but there are people getting better on the CAP. As to those people not having MS after all, I think both they and their neurologists would beg to differ.

The proof is in the pudding - ie the before and after MRI scans.

Very little of this research is currently in the public domain, but hopefully this will change when the Stratton Vanderbilt research labs starts up again very soon.

It is early days, but even some MS charities admit to a possible inconclusive cause being CPn.

Many thanks.

Mark Hall

Well, that's good news. And here i was thinking that now I got another thing wrong with this body to worry about!

Tom

I am Sarah Longlands Wheldon and Cheryl, I can say that my diagnosis was definitely secondary progressive multiple sclerosis. After having been very mild since I was 24, it suddenly turned very aggressive and the Addenbroke's based neurologist warned my husband to "make arrangements" for me. He is a consultant level microbiologist who had trained as a neuropathologist under the renowned David Openheimer at Oxford. He had previously, in his early clinical years, seen people with end-stage MS, abandoned by their families, unable to move, twisted with spasticity, blind, unable to eat except with a tube into the stomach, permanently cathetered and worse. He didn't want to see me having the same fate.

Something about the way I was reacting, though, reminded him of other people he had seen with serious infections. He therefore spent the first few days after my diagnosis searching the internet for possible answers. What he found was the Vanderbilt University research into chlamydia pneumoniae as the infective cause of MS. Having treated other such infections, he knew exactly what I needed to start with,so brought me home a pack of doxycycline.

It is now nearly five years since that diagnosis: the page which Mark was quoting from is a bit out of date. I finished treatment nearly a year ago and I have done nothing but improve since starting. There is no new disease activity on my MRIs and not only am I now painting again after having had a nearly paralysed right arm, but my mind is clearer than t has been for years. I can't say that CPn is always the infective cause of MS but it certainly was with mine and I am truly thankful for my husband of only a few years to endeavour to find this out.



Sarah

It isn't just Dr Wheldon's theory.

Others that agree with this link is Dr Charles Stratton and neurologist Dr Sriram - both at Vanderbilt, and Californian rheumatologist Dr Michael Powell.

Thanks,

Mark

It's really not Dr. Wheldon's theory alone. As Mark posted, Dr. Stratton at Vanderbilt, a well respected researcher in MS, has also engaged in the theory. These two are not alone. I researched this a lot and although I did not go on the protocol, I am a believer that at least in some, this could possibly be a cause. Aside from CPN, the potential role of bacteria is not discounted by many respected physicians. (This is what led me to CPN but there is much more on bacteria in general.) At any rate, this may be not proven, but not proven does not mean it's not true.

I really believe we probably didn't all get here the same way and I sometimes wonder if that's why finding the universally effective treatment and cure has been so difficult.

My point is, at this point in time, there is NO CURE for MS. There is no KNOWN cause for MS. That's why we are working so hard to get more and more funds for research.

This particular study has been halted and is not an accepted theory in the medical community. You know that as well as the rest of us do. Read your own literature. I have read it several times.

There are a lot of well respected people in the medical community who do not follow this theory. But I am not discounting it...it just happens to be one that I don't particularly totally believe because it is being promoted as a cure, at least the treatment is.

What is "end stage MS?" You are giving people the impression that MS is a fatal disease. It is not. Please show me where it says that MS is a fatal disease.

I for one am not stuck on any particular treatment nor theory about the cause of MS. If I was, do you think I would be involved in a clinical trial?

The current medications on the market to treat MS have failed me. I am looking for something that will help treat my particular form of MS.

So please do not treat me as if I am not educated. I have done a lot of research, but I do not claim to know everything. I also wish you would not try to use scare tactics and phrases like "end-stage" MS to get people to follow your particular protocol.

While every medication does not work for everyone, you must also understand that MS is different for everyone. It does not manifest itself the same in every person. Symptoms are different, even the same symptoms are different in the same person from one exacerbation to the next. Medications vary widely on how they effect one person to the next even the same person depending on their medications from day to day, week to week.

I just wanted to add, Cheryl, that I don't think people who come here to tell about their treatments, whether proven effective or not, should be shut out or made to feel unwelcome.

We all are educated enough to know that, what works with one MS patient, does not work for all or even many. For those who have been infected with CPN and have MS, it may be well worth looking into.

I also agree with you, that, scare tactics are unwelcome here and have no place in our caring community. You are right...there is NO cure for MS and No known exact cause, which means our own personal research is also important.

I am an LDN user and believer...Not a cure, but has helped me, without a doubt and has kept my DD in remission for 3 years, so far. She has no physical or mental signs of MS, at all!! I also know people who take Valtrex at the sign of MS symptoms and get great relief from it.

So whether its Herpes 6, CPN, Measels, mumps or whooping cough...it's something....and probably something different for us all. :confused:

Lets keep an open mind.......too many Docs have closed theirs and won't think outside the box.:rolleyes: We have to push to keep them from doing that.

Stepping down from soap box and backing slowly out of room..

Sally, I agree with you wholeheartedly! I am not telling anyone to back away...quite the opposite! Fortunately for me, I have two very open minded doctors on my team. Three if you want to count the one my local neuro consults with...

You know me very well, I am one to think outside the box otherwise why would I be in a clinical trial. :D That's one of the many points that I am trying to make here!

I have been on Beta, Beta with Methotrexate, Tysabri, Copaxone, and enough steroids to choke a horse! I have considered Cytoxan, LDN, and IvIG. Now I am a lab rat for Tovaxin! So thinking outside the box is what I do best. ( I fly outside the box, too!) :D:D

What I don't like is the "one size fits all" theory. It doesn't. :(

I have also been on drugs for other diseases to treat symptoms for my form of MS.

I asked a few simple questions. I like data to back up what is being posted. Anyone who knows me knows that. I have always been someone who questions things...I don't take anything at face value! ;)

For example, here's a few links to back up my comment about MS not being fatal:

http://www.nationalmssociety.org/about-multiple-sclerosis/FAQs-about-MS/index.aspx#fatal

http://ofcn.org/cyber.serv/hwp/support/ms/MSFAQ.html

http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/464972

http://www.nwhealth.edu/healthyU/stayHealthy/ms.html

http://www.mscenter.org/content/view/53/1/

http://www.msassociation.org/faq/

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0PYD/is_2005_March_16/ai_n17215144

Thanks for the information. While I agree not everyone experiences MS the same, it is something to look into. Discounted or not, no idea is a bad idea. Jim and I are very open to any and all therapies (except some therapies that could kill him). We never lose hope that he'll someday walk or be in remission from ms. We see Jim's spinal cord doctor on Tuesday and I'll bring this up to him and see what he thinks. He's also an active researcher for MS. Thanks to everyone for responding and for being active in the fight!

I originally started this topic to simply point out what was going on "off the radar" or "out of the box" with regard to MS in that many cases may have a bacterial cause, specifically CPn.

Please do not discount Dr Stratton's research.
Thanks,

Mark

Cheryl, I do know that Stratton's research hasn't been accepted by the general medical establishment, but could this not be because the CPn tests that other labs did differed so much in their findings? PCR tests for CPn are very unreliable because the bug is so hard to detect. In fact my doctor who diagnosed by partner with CPn infection(she has been bedridden for over 2 years with severe M.E / CFS) said that you may find not find the bug on day 1,2,3,4,5 but may on day 14) - It all depends on antibody reaction to the bug and I have stated in my first post about how this bug can hide.

Please keep an eye on the Dr Charles Stratton research. As I have said previously, he has a new research grant and is to start his lab up again.

I am not saying that CPn infection causes MS in everyone, but there are people who I talk to every day on a CPn support group, who are on the Stratton/Powell/Wheldon CAP and are getting better.

They have their MRI scans to prove it.

Take care.

Mark.

I am sure Sarah Wheldon will post a reply soon.

Thanks,

Mark

I really am not a believer in CPN and MS. I have done some research into this because this same topic came up on another forum. It's very difficult if not almost impossible to find any current studies.

I did find this which suggests there is a sub-type of MS where CPN seems to be the case, it was a small study:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1...?dopt=Abstract

Sarah, I visited your website for awhile out of curiosity. What concerned me was the mis-information about MS I was reading.

I'm sure you realize your dealing with some of us who were on the other forum and sometimes you and others who believe in the Wheldon Protocol seem to be pushing this past the point of information.

I was looking for that Snoopy! Thank you! ;)

Your Welcome! :)

Maybe I should have been a little more forth-coming about my non-progression in the Tovaxin trial...but unfortunately, I am not at liberty to discuss the details of the double-blind study that I am in. :p

That information will be released at the upcoming AAN conference. I am one of the 150 study patients that are doing well on this trial drug. ;)

Hello SallyC and Av8rgirl
 

Hello SallyC and Av8rgirl!

I hope you ladies are doing well and still remember me from the MSWorld forums.

I was that physician who never tried any conventional medical therapy and was a sort of nuisance there, because my only goal was to tell everybody that Lipitor works miracles in secondary progressive MS(in my case no neurological symptoms after 3 months on atorvastatin, however still far from perfect memory). Now, I don' even use Lipitor any more. I tried to save the world at that time.

I met Sarah Longlands on MSRC in April 2004 when she tried to spread the news about her success. No one believed her, except for me. I was already symptom-free for over a year. As sick as we were at the beginning of treatment it was difficult to decide which one of us was sicker and more hopeless. In June 2004 I decided to trade my daily 80 mg of statin for antibiotics, after all they are so much more liver friendly.

I have been taking antibiotics for over 3 years. I took them continuously for 13 months and now I take them every couple months for two weeks.

At present time my memory is very close to what it was in my youth. Chronic asthma and sinusitis are gone for the past 3 years, and I hope, forever. I passed my recertification exam in medicine last summer and achieved a very high score. Before the treatment my memory was wiped out and I had severe difficulty with concentration.

Memories of MS seem to be like bad dreams now. Sometimes I almost don't believe it really happened. I had been given a second chance in life.

I came here today by Mark Hall's suggestion. Fortunatelly for me, I don't attend any MS forums any more. I consider myself free of MS. I know it is a blasphemy for most people, but it is true for me.

I wrote about it a few times on MSWorld before, but stopped about two years ago. People who seek alternative ways to treat themselves will find all the information via the Internet. I had a patient for the first time in my office asking for the antibiotics for Chlamydia pneumoniae two months after her MS diagnosis.

Most MS patients feel secure with the therapy they receive from their neurologists. I know how easy it was for me to lose the independence. On the other side, it is hard to accomplish and not to share with others.

If only conventional medicine would bring a cure to all MS patients than we would not have to stay separated by any doubts about our credibility.

Barbara.

I love discussions like this....Knowledge is Power!!!:)

And Thank You Cheryl..Hugs!

Just a heads up - Mark Hall has posted the same thread in other forums here at NT.

I just replied to the same info he posted in the Alzheimer's thread.

Sorry, but I've read all this same information under different names, on different sites, and I don't even live in the same country as you do!! :mad:

I know, it gets old doesn't it :mad:

I have not discounted Dr. Stratton's research. At this point in time, there is no final research. I do believe it was halted. I have read what there is...I have read your website as well as Dr. Weldon's. Suffice it to say if you and the rest of your cohorts read my posts in context, you will see that I am NOT flatly discounting anything on your website. I clearly stated that at this time there is NO KNOWN cause for MS. I do not appreciate being paraphrased or misquoted out of context.

It is unbecoming to belittle others who have chosen a different course of treatment for their particular course of disease. There are many different forms of treatment and if one chooses to take a different road than someone else, that does not make one a dunce. You have no way of knowing what I have been through, or anyone else for that matter. It is really none of your business.

As we all know from experience, each one of us is different and may have medical or personal reasons for choosing the path we have chosen for our particular course of treatment. These are personal choices. It is not up to you or anyone else to question these decisions.

Thanks to medical research, today we have many choices of treatment for MS. Do not make the mistake of thinking that one size fits all.

Cheryl, I am not belittling others.

As I have said previously, I am just pointing people into a different direction of research to look into - you may not agree with it, but is this not supposed to be an open forum where people can post ideas and other research?

As to the post in the Alzheimers forum, i was posting a reference to another doctor who is looking into the links between Alzheimers and CPn. Dr Balin is his name.

Thank you for your warm welcome. I don't know why I even bother. :-(

Mark

I'm sorry Mr.Hall but this reads like one of those 'miracle' cures in the back of a tabloid. JMO
I have a feeling that I'm talking to myself since you haven't posted for a while *wink, wink* :)

Actually Joelle, my understanding (I could be wrong) they do believe the Weldon Protocol eradicates MS as well as many other disorders.

If I remember correctly they use very high doses of 2 (3?) antibiotics for 2 to 5 years possibly longer.

I always thought that the longer you took an antibiotic the less effective it becomes. Eventually you just build an immunity to it. Wouldn't this be counterproductive in the event you had a true infection and needed an AB for it?

Like the rest of you I find it hard to fathom that this could actually be a valid treatment option for many of us.

Mr Hall

I am not referring to your posts anywhere at Neurotalk.

Have a great day!

Thanks, Mark, Barbara and Sarah,

MS is not a one size fits all disease, and if there is a “cure” out there waiting for the taking, it is very unlikely to work on each and every one of us anyway. I think it goes without saying that the “cure” for each of us, as individuals, might be something different.

Many of us already know that we might have to be willing to try many different options to TREAT the disease, and we STILL may not have luck with the various current mainstream options available. If Rebif doesn’t work, we might try Betaseron. If that doesn’t work, we may move to Copaxone, Tysabri, chemo, or . . . Sometimes none of those make any difference what-so-ever.

People with PPMS (and SPMS) don’t have many moderately successful options available, but many of them are willing to try drugs like Tysabri or Copaxone. There is often no “scientific proof” to back up any claim that these people might benefit from most mainstream drugs . . . but sometimes it simply comes down to “what do we have to lose?” (even if there is no direct evidence that there is potential benefit).

When it comes to evaluating alternative therapies, I want to know “who” has “what” to gain (besides us). In this instance, I also want to know:

- Is there any known safety concern with taking this level of antibiotics, even theoretical safety concerns?
- How do we get access to these meds/how does one convince a doctor to prescribe this antibiotic regime?
- Is anyone making money off this, or is it readily available generic therapy?
- Does this treatment contradict anything we might currently be using, i.e. do we need to quit using Copaxone in order to try it?
- What is the 'anecdotal' success rate?

Thanks,

Cherie

this is all very confusing to me especially the virus part of it, cause a larger portion of females get ms right, so how does a virus specify a gender? never heard of that before,

and if it was a virus caused an illness i would think it would be a lot more wide spread like the common cold at this point with the amount of travel involved and how many of us worked and still work and interact with others and sneeze cough breath, its not like ms folks live on an island.

Am I missing the drift here and should i go annoy the folks in the game room? or is my confusion legit, it almost seems as if his finding are too miraculous almost as if some xyz factor in his study cause this end result.

I mean it would be great if it were this simple, something about this, I hear my grandpa saying if its too good to be true , it is

Why should you bother? Good question. Is it because you want to help others? Whatever your reason, you are pushing too hard and you don't take well to other people's legitimate doubts, that it would help All..:rolleyes:

I am thrilled for you and the others, that this Therapy seems to be helping and I don't doubt your belief, for a moment, that it is. On the other hand, it is not a cure for MS, as you and your fellow patients have touted.

You are not the only 3 people on this regimin that I, personally, have talked to. Several have tried this AB regimine and failed......Guess what, they still have MS. I suspect that those of you who have MS, still have it.

LDN has stopped my progression, but I am NOT cured!!! It has even minimized some of my MS sx, but they are still there. A lot of people touted LDN as a cureall, at first, as well, and that's why people just didn't believe it. I started it, thinking it was going to cure me of MS and I was so mad, when it didn't.:mad: I stuck with it, though, and am so glad I did ....and am, still.

I'm glad you came here to tell us about your therapy, and now, give us all the chance to look into it and make our own educated decisions, without your further critique.

Thanks...:)

Another voice of hope
 

Hello everyone.:)
I have just joined this site in order to add my two cents: I have ppms. There is absolutely no treatment for ppms and every study I have ever seen rejects participants with ppms. It took three months for my neurologist at Johns Hopkins to assure herself that the Wheldon/Stratton protocol would cause no harm and would not lead to antibiotic resistance. I have been on the regimen therefore for one year now and 1) my mind fog has cleared 2) my amblyopia for which I had used prisms totally cleared and 3) I can now signal the muscles below my waist and am therefore finally being given physical therapy (it was thought hopeless before) and relearning how to walk without a cane.

Those of you familiar with ppms know that it never improves; it only gets worse -- as it had been doing steadily for years. Perhaps CAP is not for everyone, but it is the only thing available for me -- and it works!

Plus, the therapy causes no harm and might therefore be worth taking a chance on. No one is making money from this therapy. The drugs are all generic antibiotics. And the team at Vanderbilt University that first researched cpn is now opening a new laboratory to continue the research.

Well done Mark! What we can't see can kill us! There are many bacterial infections, candida, mycoplasma, c.pneumonia, strep that can wreak havoc in our bodies in additional to viral infections like herpes, EBV, HPV.

My experience with neurologists is they are intellectually bankrupt in that they are unable to think out of the box. It is quite disturbing that in 50 years the neuros have been unable to come up with an explanation as to WHY the bodies immune system is attacking our bodies. In the meantime, patients are dying & losing their life at great expense to themselves & extended family. There hasn't been anything done for MS for example, except treat symptoms as they arise at a great human cost in pharmaceutical side affects. Illnesses like MS & ME can be death sentences; there is no candy coating this fact.

My experience in my "road back" from ME is I didn't realize how bad I really was. I have seen this same thing in friends with MS. They have been lulled into a false sense of security. I thank God everyday for my fabulous MD who is treating me with a combined antibiotic protocol. I am about 40% better overall than 2 years ago & I am only 9 months into treatment.

Remember, there was a time when the common belief was the world was flat. Medicine is changing daily; in a couple of decades we will look back & think DUH, doesn't that make sense!!

Perhaps the post Av8rgirl is referring to is on this forum and not on Neurotalk. Interesting reading...

*link removed* in edit

Regardless of why you are here, your information is appreciated and I am sure will be read by a lot of folks here. We are always open to information.

What we are not interested in is people who do not support choice. We are also not interested in personal attacks. This is a support board for people with MS, where we support each others choices, no matter what they choose.

If the Wheldon Protocol works for you, that's wonderful. I am sure you came to your choice after a LOT of thought and reading and discussion. So did everyone here. There may be people here who might benefit from your posts, but many of us have seen you on other boards through the years and remember. Attacking valued members for their choices is NOT the way to enter into or foster discussion.

I don't know anyone who takes sticking a needle in their body or infusing a drug into their body or searching for a solution that works for them lightly. Please don't treat us as if we do. You will get the same consideration if you and your friends try a more respectful approach.

Just out of curiosity, what antibiotics are used in this treatment? Jim has been on antibiotics for five years and he still has ms. He's been on augmentin, cipro, macrobid, gatafloxin, doxycyline, etc. I am not knocking anyone, just curious.

Is there any tests that would show if the CPn infection is involved?
Or do you try the antibiotic protocol and see if it works or not?

I'm thinking that if it's is kind of like Lyme Disease, where you need to do specific tests and maybe more than one time before it is conclusive.
I believe it also requires long term antibiotic protocols for treatment.

just wondering..