"And, you think I am NOT in bad, bad shape. Therefore, I should quit my 'belly-aching' and get a job. Correct?"

And this is why I feel like I'm knocking my head against a wall when trying to communicate with you.

I never made any such claim. In fact, I said I thought it would be a good idea for you to follow up with additional treatment due to the severity of your impairments regardless of your SSDI application.

I have tried to make it clear to you that not only is the ongoing treatment you attempt important to SS, but so is the documentation of your limitations by an appropriate medical source, and that that the entire process is a complicated medical/LEGAL evaluation.

The "45 page" document you apparently didn't even scan, should not take you hours to read. Many of the pages are no more than a few sentences blown up in large font to make it easy for people to read. Half of the document is dedicated to what happens if a claimant passes Step 4 and what the process is at Step 5.

I would definitely defer to Lit Love as I have a very limited understanding and it has been a while since I did MY extensive research.

But, as Lit Love has already posted, there are 3 ways to get approved. How do you know which methods were utilized and where you went off the rails?

A denial letter does not normally state the express reasons for denial but give some generalities if I remember correctly.

You may have been unable to clear step 2 on severity based upon the information SSDI had at the time.

What exactly did your denial letter state? That would give you "some" indication of the point at which you failed to qualify.

I had to get a copy of my file in order to find out where my claim failed approval. Even with a copy of my file, it was still not indicative of the deficits of my claim.

From the file, I did find that some medical records had been overlooked, and it was my belief that my denial was long before step 5.

Here is an over simplification as I understand it but keep in mind that MY understanding may be flawed. It is just the way I perceive the process.

The process: A person files a claim for disability.

Additional paperwork is requested by SSA and the applicant and a third party complete the requested papers and return them to SSA.

At this point, it is in the hands of SSA and they begin to gather information from treating sources you listed on your paperwork.

It is after they have gathered the information, they review your file and determine if you are eligible for benefits. THEY will utilize ALL methods to see if you qualify, ie, a listing, the grid, or the 5 step process.

It was during this process, the determination was made that for some reason, based on the information at hand, you do not qualify for benefits and a denial letter was sent to you.

The question is WHY you did not meet the qualifications. It could be that based on the medical information in your file did not indicate your medical conditions severe enough to go any further. This would have stopped the process at step 2 in the 5 step process.

The applicant does not decide which method is used for determination. This is a guided process used to see if an applicant is eligible under any of the methods and is determined and considered by SSA.

To jump to the conclusion you reached step 5 and that is the only stumbling block to cross for approval is not realistic.

As a well informed applicant, fully knowing and understanding the process, one can make some assumptions as to the reason and place it was determined that you were not eligible for benefits.

Based on the information provided in your posts and threads, a well informed person could possibly determine that you did not meet a listing, did not fit into the grid rules, and were denied during the 5 step process.

Without seeing the file compiled by SSDI, no one can tell you exactly what step at which you were denied benefits.

It could very well be that you were not considered to have a "severe" enough condition (step 2) to be eligible.

That does not mean that you are NOT experiencing the symptoms that you claim. This does not mean that you are not compromised in your ability to function at your normal levels. This is NOT a reflection upon YOUR abilities. It is simply that with the information at hand and in front of the SSDI (in your file), you do not meet their severity test at step 2.

This could be for various reasons. Maybe something was over looked. Maybe your medical records as obtained by SSDI did not substantiate your claim.

Maybe you DID in fact make it to step 5 but you do not know that to be the case.

You may want to ask your attorney what was indicated in your file. That will not provide you with all the answers and specifics but it may give you a better insight into the reason you were found ineligible for benefits.

Before and during the appeal process, you should obtain as much information as possible to discover the area(s) where you fell short of approval and then take actions to provide better or more documentation that can benefit your claim at an ALJ hearing.

Hope this helps a little.

It is only my assumption, but I think you took this too literally.

I do not think Lit Love was stating as a FACT, that you made it to step 5 and was denied there.

I understood her post to mean that she was giving you a scenario that MAY be the case based upon information YOU provided in your postings.

For instance, in her post, and I quote: SS then would have ruled........ To ME, that is a scenario, NOT a fact of what transpired.

Lit Love does not have a copy of your file, is not the person that denied your claim, and has never stated that she knows exactly why you were denied benefits. She has given you answers to scenarios, given you the rules, the guidelines, and everything imaginable to assist you but I do not see that she has ever said that she KNOWS the reason YOU were denied benefits as a factual matter.

Lit Love has given you guidance that no attorney would have ever spent the time to provide.

If you were to ask your attorney, exactly WHY you were denied, he/she would not be able to tell you that specifically. He/she can't say that you were at step 5 or not. He/she could make an educated guess but he/she is also privy to information about and in your file that no one on NT has available to them.

SSDI does not come out and say, "Well, you made it all the way to step 5, but that is where we denied your claim."

The process is very complicated, and it is not just a matter of having symptoms, a diagnosis, and medical documentation supporting a diagnosis.

You may want to talk with your attorney and see if an appeal is appropriate for your situation and if so, start getting all your ducks in a row.

Remember there is a time limit for filing an appeal.

If you intend to appeal the decision, be sure you do it within the time frame.

Here is the problem and the confusion, the OP send me pm's and then quoted my response to those pm's on the public forum. D--please try not to post publicly things shared in pm's.

D actually quoted a portion of the denial letter to me, that is a form letter, but it does indicate at what point in the process a claimant is denied.

He can choose to share or not share, what his denial stated if he wishes, or I can post the quote from his pm if he requests that I do.

That clears things up tremendously for me. I had mentioned that I felt like I had missed something, like a chapter in a book, and I guess I really had.

As I mentioned, I defer to you, as my comments are based upon the research I did and on my own personal experiences.

My denial did not state the reason for denial in any way. It was only when I obtained a copy of my file, did I discover what I believed to have been the stumbling block. I believe I fell off the cliff at "severity" and discovered what condition(s) they had reviewed. They focused on conditions that I have that are NOT disabling. If that had been my only condition, I, too, would have denied me immediately.

Since they have you list all of your conditions, not just the ones that make you unable to perform job duties, I can understand why the focus was not on the proper conditions, the disabling ones.

Thanks for clearing up things for me. The poster is benefitted greatly by your assistance. (And ME, too.) Thanks for getting the record straight and correcting the mis-statements I made in my post.

You are the BEST.

Sorry about the PM error. That was not my intent. You can quote any PM I sent you if you'd like.

Dear canifindagooddr,

Sorry my post was in error but I was missing some pieces to the puzzle.

I did not realize that you were informed of the point of denial.

(I was not in my case.)

I hope my posts did not confuse matters any further.

No worries friend. I appreciate all that you and Lit do. I can just process so much info at a time. I have many 'legal irons' in the fire right now . . .

Got to go. Get to spend time with my three beauties tonight. And, then I have them all day Saturday.