yep.....I agree with chnged diagnostics leading to changed diagnoses!!

what actually got my attention even more with all the soy stuff was not so much any bearing it may or may not have on TS, but rather the issue of babies being exposed to the oestrogenic isoflavones
that, and the issue of high manganese and aluminum in soy formula is sure a bit alarming!!

the phytoestrogens are much weaker physiologically than mammalian estrogen.
So I always get rather confused when articles state the horrors of soy formula.

Soy WILL complex out zinc however, and that is not good.

If formula is the ONLY source of food, I would be concerned as well. If it is a supplement to a toddler, I would expect less effect.

The estrogen issues is complex... try to understand THIS:
http://toxsci.oxfordjournals.org/cgi...stract/80/1/14

http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/full/79/3/396

on rats:
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/m...2/ai_n14816156

This article gives potencies of various "estrogens"
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/m...32/ai_20153477
Genestein is about 1000 times less potent than Estradiol.
I have read "thousand" before in earlier papers, and perhaps more than a thousand.

I have often wondered how much estrogen we get from meat. ???
Also the environment is full of estrogenic compounds as well. (water)
Some fire retardants are anti-thyroid in actions, for example.

Not an easy subject to understand, with many conflicting studies so far.

sure is a complex subject mrsD

I think the major cause for concern seems to be the infants that are being fed soy from birth and as their main nutritional source for those early developmental years

I was a vegitarian while preggers and beyond, and ate mucho soy. Though I also consumed eggs/milk/cheese.

Very interesting discussion, thanks.

I really take some issue with those scary statements about babies exposed
to estrogen from soy.

You are aware that both sexes are exposed to hormones in the womb.
Male babies have large genitalia and often can even have small breasts when
delivered. This typically resolves with time.

If babies were exposed to the level of estrogen stated in those articles--we'd SEE the effects.
Now isoflavones are very very weak estrogens, thousands of times weaker than the estrogens used in birth control pills.
So these statements are confusing and alarming without backup data, on cause/effect. Just about every living thing has estrogenic compounds in it...plants use these estrogenic related compounds as antioxidants. I recall reading an article in Science News not too long ago that estrogens are in mulloscs (snails). Babies who are breastfed get minute amounts of human hormones as well.

We would SEE the effects on the genitalia of those babies..and I have not seen articles to that effect.
However, if a female fetus is exposed to birth control pills, there can be damage to the developing genitalia of that child.. this is known.

Here is an interesting article on xenoestrogens in the environment...and I think these are much more alarming.
http://www.coem.com/conference-details.asp?confid=18
It is postulated that the increase of early menarche (in some areas in girls 8yrs old) is due to xenoestrogen and estrogen in meat exposures.

I still think we are not receiving accurate data on this topic. And it has been 10 years of controversy sadly.

interesting info mrsD ..........thanks for adding good balance to the controversy.

Thanks Mrs. D.

I agree on this .... Here is an interesting article on xenoestrogens in the environment...and I think these are much more alarming.

I read an interesting article related to our conversation, that speaks about many environmental substances: New Thinking on Neurodevelopment

Snip...

The notion that some substances in the environment can damage the nervous system has an ancient history. The neurotoxicity of lead was recognized more than 2,000 years ago by the Greek physician Dioscerides, who wrote, “Lead makes the mind give way.” In the intervening millennia many other substances have been added to the list of known or suspected neurotoxicants. Despite this accumulation of knowledge, there is still much that isn’t understood about how neurotoxicants affect the developing brain, especially the effects of low-dose exposures. Today researchers are taking a hard look at low-dose exposures in utero and during childhood to unravel some of the mysteries of impaired neurodevelopment.

LINK

I highly recommend it, it's an interesting read.