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Old 11-26-2011, 04:14 AM #1
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Default How to double your on time!!

I think I need help with this one. Two days ago I took a 50mg dose of Stavelo, together with my normal meds of rasagiline, amantadine, and trihexyphenidy at 8-00am. I switched on at 8-30am. Everything normal, but I then stayed on and on, until 3-00pm, when I switched off. That is 6.5 hours from one 5omg tablet!! I normally only get 2 to 3 hours,
What caused it, well I remembered taking a glass of fruit juice, namely grapefruit. I was aware of the restrictions of drugs and grapefruit juice but nothing generally affects me. I duplicated the experiment yesterday and again got exactly the same result.
The only negative point is safety. There are about 50 drugs which interact with grapefruit, but are any PD drugs on the list? I did a quick search, and did not find any, but we need a very careful search. Apparently grapefruit juice and certain drugs both use ther same enzyme to break down.
If it is safe, this would be a huge step forward.
Ron
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Old 11-26-2011, 05:33 PM #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronhutton View Post
I think I need help with this one. Two days ago I took a 50mg dose of Stavelo, together with my normal meds of rasagiline, amantadine, and trihexyphenidy at 8-00am. I switched on at 8-30am. Everything normal, but I then stayed on and on, until 3-00pm, when I switched off. That is 6.5 hours from one 5omg tablet!! I normally only get 2 to 3 hours,
What caused it, well I remembered taking a glass of fruit juice, namely grapefruit. I was aware of the restrictions of drugs and grapefruit juice but nothing generally affects me. I duplicated the experiment yesterday and again got exactly the same result.
The only negative point is safety. There are about 50 drugs which interact with grapefruit, but are any PD drugs on the list? I did a quick search, and did not find any, but we need a very careful search. Apparently grapefruit juice and certain drugs both use ther same enzyme to break down.
If it is safe, this would be a huge step forward.
Ron
no clues here
http://www.parkinsonswellness.org/nutrition.html
someone likes orange juice, stomach acidity
http://www.centralohioparkinson.org/...e=doc&id=10098
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Old 11-27-2011, 08:23 AM #3
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Default Worth trying

Ron-
I did a little looking (but not in depth). It seems that there are two or three ways for grapefruit juice to affect the apple cart-
1) It can influence the actions of certain enzymes (e.g. cytochrome P450) and affect serum levels of medications that are broken down by those enzymes. Depending on the medication, those levels can increase or decrease.
2) It can increase bioavailability of drugs that are absorbed from the small intestine by increasing the permeability of that barrier. This is the one that intrigues me for obvious reasons.
3) There are hints of a similar effect at your old friend the BBB, too.

Bottom line is a bit of trial and error, but it looks darned promising. -Rick

Food-drug interactions: grapefruit juice.

Diaconu CH, Cuciureanu M, Vlase L, Cuciureanu R.

Rev Med Chir Soc Med Nat Iasi. 2011 Jan-Mar;115(1):245-50.

PMID:
21682192
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Related citations
2.

Effect of grapefruit juice in relation to human pharmacokinetic study.

Uno T, Yasui-Furukori N.

Curr Clin Pharmacol. 2006 May;1(2):157-61. Review.

PMID:
18666368
[PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

Related citations
3.

[Grapefruit juice and drugs: a hazardous combination?].

Lohezic-Le Devehat F, Marigny K, Doucet M, Javaudin L.

Therapie. 2002 Sep-Oct;57(5):432-45. Review. French.

PMID:
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4.

Grapefruit-drug interactions.

Seden K, Dickinson L, Khoo S, Back D.

Drugs. 2010 Dec 24;70(18):2373-407. doi: 10.2165/11585250-000000000-00000. Review.

PMID:
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5.

Grapefruit juice and drug interactions. Exploring mechanisms of this interaction and potential toxicity for certain drugs.

Bressler R.

Geriatrics. 2006 Nov;61(11):12-8. Review.

PMID:
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6.

The effects of fruit juices on drug disposition: a new model for drug interactions.

Dresser GK, Bailey DG.

Eur J Clin Invest. 2003 Nov;33 Suppl 2:10-6. Review.

PMID:
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Related citations
7.

Interactions between grapefruit juice and cardiovascular drugs.

Bailey DG, Dresser GK.

Am J Cardiovasc Drugs. 2004;4(5):281-97. Review.

PMID:
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[PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

Related citations
8.

Undesirable effects of citrus juice on the pharmacokinetics of drugs: focus on recent studies.

Saito M, Hirata-Koizumi M, Matsumoto M, Urano T, Hasegawa R.

Drug Saf. 2005;28(8):677-94. Review.

PMID:
16048354
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Related citations
9.

Drug interactions with grapefruit juice. Extent, probable mechanism and clinical relevance.

Fuhr U.

Drug Saf. 1998 Apr;18(4):251-72. Review.

PMID:
9565737
[PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

Related citations
10.

[Grapefruit juice interactions with psychotropic drugs: advantages and potential risk].

Pawełczyk T, Kłoszewska I.

Przegl Lek. 2008;65(2):92-5. Review. Polish.

PMID:
18663908
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Related citations
11.

The effect of grapefruit juice on drug disposition.

Hanley MJ, Cancalon P, Widmer WW, Greenblatt DJ.

Expert Opin Drug Metab Toxicol. 2011 Mar;7(3):267-86. Epub 2011 Jan 22. Review.

PMID:
21254874
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Related citations
12.

Grapefruit juice enhances intestinal absorption of the P-glycoprotein substrate talinolol.

Spahn-Langguth H, Langguth P.

Eur J Pharm Sci. 2001 Feb;12(4):361-7. Review.

PMID:
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Related citations
13.

[Grapefruit juice: potential drug interaction].

Palumbo G, Bacchi S, Palumbo P, Primavera LG, Sponta AM.

Clin Ter. 2005 May-Jun;156(3):97-103. Review. Italian.

PMID:
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Related citations
14.

Food-drug interaction: grapefruit juice augments drug bioavailability--mechanism, extent and relevance.

Dahan A, Altman H.

Eur J Clin Nutr. 2004 Jan;58(1):1-9. Review.

PMID:
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Related citations
15.

Fruit juice inhibition of uptake transport: a new type of food-drug interaction.

Bailey DG.

Br J Clin Pharmacol. 2010 Nov;70(5):645-55. doi: 10.1111/j.1365-2125.2010.03722.x. Review.

PMID:
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Free PMC Article

Related citations
16.

Inhibition of cytochrome P450 by furanocoumarins in grapefruit juice and herbal medicines.

Guo LQ, Yamazoe Y.

Acta Pharmacol Sin. 2004 Feb;25(2):129-36. Review.

PMID:
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Related citations
17.

Review article: cytochrome P450 enzyme, and transport protein mediated herb-drug interactions in renal transplant patients: grapefruit juice, St John's Wort - and beyond!

Nowack R.

Nephrology (Carlton). 2008 Jun;13(4):337-47. Epub 2008 Mar 17. Review.

PMID:
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Related citations
18.

Grapefruit juice-drug interactions.

Bailey DG, Malcolm J, Arnold O, Spence JD.

Br J Clin Pharmacol. 1998 Aug;46(2):101-10. Review.

PMID:
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Free PMC Article

Related citations
19.

Drug interactions with grapefruit juice.

Ameer B, Weintraub RA.

Clin Pharmacokinet. 1997 Aug;33(2):103-21. Review.

PMID:
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Related citations
20.

The grapefruit: an old wine in a new glass? Metabolic and cardiovascular perspectives.

Owira PM, Ojewole JA.

Cardiovasc J Afr. 2010 Sep-Oct;21(5):280-5. Review.

PMID:
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Free Article

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21.

Grapefruit juice-drug interaction studies as a method to assess the extent of intestinal availability: utility and limitations.

Gertz M, Davis JD, Harrison A, Houston JB, Galetin A.

Curr Drug Metab. 2008 Oct;9(8):785-95. Review.

PMID:
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Related citations
22.

Medicinal importance of grapefruit juice and its interaction with various drugs.

Kiani J, Imam SZ.

Nutr J. 2007 Oct 30;6:33. Review.

PMID:
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Free PMC Article

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23.

Influence of dietary components on the gastrointestinal metabolism and transport of drugs.

Evans AM.

Ther Drug Monit. 2000 Feb;22(1):131-6. Review.

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Related citations
24.

Interaction of grapefruit juice and calcium channel blockers.

Sica DA.

Am J Hypertens. 2006 Jul;19(7):768-73. Review.

PMID:
16814135
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Related citations
25.

Analysis of drug interactions involving fruit beverages and organic anion-transporting polypeptides.

Greenblatt DJ.

J Clin Pharmacol. 2009 Dec;49(12):1403-7. Epub 2009 Sep 29. Review.

PMID:
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Related citations
26.

Grape fruit juice-drug interactions.

Arayne MS, Sultana N, Bibi Z.

Pak J Pharm Sci. 2005 Oct;18(4):45-57. Review.

PMID:
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Related citations
27.

Influence of dietary substances on intestinal drug metabolism and transport.

Won CS, Oberlies NH, Paine MF.

Curr Drug Metab. 2010 Nov;11(9):778-92. Review.

PMID:
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Born in 1953, 1st symptoms and misdiagnosed as essential tremor in 1992. Dx with PD in 2000.
Currently (2011) taking 200/50 Sinemet CR 8 times a day + 10/100 Sinemet 3 times a day. Functional 90% of waking day but fragile. Failure at exercise but still trying. Constantly experimenting. Beta blocker and ACE inhibitor at present. Currently (01/2013) taking ldopa/carbadopa 200/50 CR six times a day + 10/100 form 3 times daily. Functional 90% of day. Update 04/2013: L/C 200/50 8x; Beta Blocker; ACE Inhib; Ginger; Turmeric; Creatine; Magnesium; Potassium. Doing well.
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Old 11-27-2011, 10:10 AM #4
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Default

Coincidently, I started about a month ago to drink grapefruit juice after a break of almost 6 years. I had stopped when I was put on statins.

I have not noticed an effect that I can directly attribute to grapefruit. However, the last few weeks have been good for me. I had put this down to more exercise, both normal and forced.

Regarding the literature, see the blog of D. J. Kroll:

http://scienceblogs.com/terrasig/200...a_drug_boo.php

"Grapefruit juice as a 'drug booster': don't try this at home"

Linking this to another current thread there are comments on the impact of grapefruit juice on DXM.

John
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Old 11-27-2011, 01:22 PM #5
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Default grapefrtuit juice

Hi Rick,
If that is a short literature search, gosh!!
I would love to know if anyone else experiences the boost in on time. However, take it carefully, interactions with certain drugs are very bad. Certainly I tried it for 2 days and had no bad symptoms or side effects. I don't think big pharma will be too pleased, probably why it is not widely known.
There is a list of 50 drugs where grapefruit juice intereacts with them, but I have not managed to find it yet.
Thanks again for your mamouth list of refs.
Ron
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Old 11-27-2011, 01:47 PM #6
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Thumbs Up grapefruit juice as a drugs booster

Hi Johnt,
Thanks for your link, it gives one explanation as to the mechanism of this boost to drugs.

"). So, taking felodipine while drinking grapefruit juice was essentially the same as taking a higher dose of the drug because its elimination from the body was slowed. Today's WSJ article and blog post discuss the experimental and commercial approach to using CYP3A4 inhibitors as "dose boosters" to minimize the dose one needs to take of some very expensive drugs.

I did say big pharma would not be amused!!
Before we get into this, is there a clinical trial somewhere in ther literature?
If there is, it is quite likely that it has been suppressed for reasons given above.
Levodpa is a cheap drug, but with over 5 million sufferers worldwide, half of the market being lost would be horrendous for the suippliers. From our point of view, halving your sinemet would delay the onset of dyskinesia, or reduced dyskinesia in more advanced patients.
Ron









Quote:
Originally Posted by johnt View Post
Coincidently, I started about a month ago to drink grapefruit juice after a break of almost 6 years. I had stopped when I was put on statins.

I have not noticed an effect that I can directly attribute to grapefruit. However, the last few weeks have been good for me. I had put this down to more exercise, both normal and forced.

Regarding the literature, see the blog of D. J. Kroll:

http://scienceblogs.com/terrasig/200...a_drug_boo.php

"Grapefruit juice as a 'drug booster': don't try this at home"

Linking this to another current thread there are comments on the impact of grapefruit juice on DXM.

John
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Old 11-27-2011, 05:42 PM #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronhutton View Post
I think I need help with this one. Two days ago I took a 50mg dose of Stavelo, together with my normal meds of rasagiline, amantadine, and trihexyphenidy at 8-00am. I switched on at 8-30am. Everything normal, but I then stayed on and on, until 3-00pm, when I switched off. That is 6.5 hours from one 5omg tablet!! I normally only get 2 to 3 hours,
What caused it, well I remembered taking a glass of fruit juice, namely grapefruit. I was aware of the restrictions of drugs and grapefruit juice but nothing generally affects me. I duplicated the experiment yesterday and again got exactly the same result.
The only negative point is safety. There are about 50 drugs which interact with grapefruit, but are any PD drugs on the list? I did a quick search, and did not find any, but we need a very careful search. Apparently grapefruit juice and certain drugs both use ther same enzyme to break down.
If it is safe, this would be a huge step forward.
Ron
does grapefuit basically add more entacapone affect?
http://www.drugbank.ca/drugs/DB00323
click on enzymes at the top.
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Old 11-27-2011, 11:16 PM #8
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I checked a few drug interaction lists and PD drugs aren't mentioned in the ones I saw. So I tried grapefruit juice with my Sinemet and Mirapex today with no effect. I used Ruby Red grapefruit juice, 100% juice, no sugar added. I wonder if the type of grapefruit juice makes a difference or maybe it's the different meds we're taking. Or like everyone keeps saying, we're all different. Hope it keeps working for you, Ron.
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Old 11-28-2011, 03:54 AM #9
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Default Grapefruit booster effect

Hi Wendy,
Sorry you got no effect, but it may be the type of juice used or when you take it. I did not use red grapefruit It was a carton from a local supermarket marked as 100% grapejuice from concentrate. I don't know the optimum time to take it but I took the juice about an hour after taking my meds. There was no warning on the carton about it's effect on drugs.
Ron
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Old 11-28-2011, 09:10 AM #10
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Ron,

The more I read about this the more it sounds like an episode of the (USA) TV program "House".

Scary to mess with our personal drug factory that is the human body.

I'm going to try some grapefruit juice, but VERY cautiously!

Mike


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronhutton View Post
I think I need help with this one. Two days ago I took a 50mg dose of Stavelo, together with my normal meds of rasagiline, amantadine, and trihexyphenidy at 8-00am. I switched on at 8-30am. Everything normal, but I then stayed on and on, until 3-00pm, when I switched off. That is 6.5 hours from one 5omg tablet!! I normally only get 2 to 3 hours,
What caused it, well I remembered taking a glass of fruit juice, namely grapefruit. I was aware of the restrictions of drugs and grapefruit juice but nothing generally affects me. I duplicated the experiment yesterday and again got exactly the same result.
The only negative point is safety. There are about 50 drugs which interact with grapefruit, but are any PD drugs on the list? I did a quick search, and did not find any, but we need a very careful search. Apparently grapefruit juice and certain drugs both use ther same enzyme to break down.
If it is safe, this would be a huge step forward.
Ron
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