[pegleg]

Back in the old days, a bunch of us found refuge in an online forum. In this particular archived thread a lot of people really got into this topic. Let me spark your intrest with a sampling of some posts, then go to the link to read it in its entireity. I'd like to hear your comments:

http://web.archive.org/web/200206150...ML/005166.html

Delmar I really don't have any wisdom to add but, I think of myself as a classic example of someone whose low self-esteem, depression and obsessive thinking has caused my condition to become much worse than it might have been, so this psychosomatic, mind/body stuff interests me.

jonathan2 WE know that we can "talk" ourselves into a good or bad mood and accordingly effect our feelings which trigger chemical responses in our system. Science acknowledges that we use a minor part of our brain so there is more capacity then we currently use. Over a long period of time we have let our selves be influenced by negative thoughts. If you do not agree with this statement, for one day critically listen to every word and thought and mark down the times a "negative" crops up. I can't I won't, it won't work, etc etc. Tally it up at the end of the day and then tell me we aren't negative.

Caring If I could convince my brain that it was never poisoned, I would be in pretty good shape. My brain knew I was poisoned before I did, yet the symptoms kept piling up despite my denial of it. So the mind over matter thing isn't necessarily a cure. Believe me, I told myself for a long time that I would get better, and that there was NO reason why I should be having all the problems I was. Unfortunately, in my case, mind over matter kept me from seeking help from a doctor earlier. I was determined to get better.

toyL569 NOTHING exists outside the consciousness WE presume lies in our head. Red is not red until your eye perceives a certain wavelength of light and then, a few milli-seconds later, notifies your brain. A smashed thumb is nevertheless a bloody mess--even if you're too drunk to notice that you have struck it dead-on. I have never considered my parkinsons disease to have a psychological origin. I have always thought of it as a physilogical problem. For whatever reason, my CNS is not producing enough dopamine.

Ron I think there is some truth in the idea that some of our woes are "in the mind." I often get absorbed in my computer, then log off and walk away. Suddenly, I will realise I have gone way past my meds time, and suddenly I can't walk!

pegleg From reading this report, it indicates that a �normal brain,� one that is not genetically inclined to be bipolar or schizophrenic, etc. (and even that may be affected!) CAN actually become diseased by an imbalance of certain chemicals in the body (such as too much adrenaline and acidity in the stomach from �worry� has been proven to cause ulcers). Thus, even the Surgeon General is now acknowledging that certain prolonged emotions not dealt with properly and for a prolonged time CAN manifest itself physically! Here I want to give some examples: stress (let�s say from being abused in childhood), or a feeling of helplessness (death of a spouse leaving the mate destitute and in deep financial trouble

digicam If anyone's interested, I am sure the "mind over matter" thing can have a great effect on our quality of life. After more than 6 years with PD, I still take no medication at all.... I have all the Parkinson related problems: but then,people on a cocktail of drugs have all the problems also !!

[Stitcher]

Contrary to my lengthy and sad post in the "other" thread, I do believe this theory. Whatever you call it "talking to onesself" "mind over matter" meditation, Yoga...while we can't "think" ourselves out of PD, we can control how we move through life.

I have always considered my PD not to be a burden, but to be a partner of sorts. I walk with it, I don't live through it. My depression is in no way connected to my PD, but to my past 58 years of living.

There is tons of information on the Internet about:
Power of a super attitude, USA Today, Updated 10/12/2004 8:04 PM

Self-Healing, Patents, and Placebos, 1989, National Library of Medicine

The Power of Positive Thinking, PsychCentral, May 29, 2006

Mental Health Problems and Mind-Body Wellness - Positive Thinking, WebMD,

1. Create positive expectations for health and healing.
2. Open yourself to humor, friendship, and love.
3. Appeal to a higher power.

The list goes on. The hard part for some of us is believing...having faith that life is good regardless of the circumstance.

Create positive expectations for health and healing...hummm...the only way I can relate to this to say right now my health is poor...I know it but I am doing something about it. My internist told me just yesterday in a very nice way to "get off my tush" and walk 30 minutes a day. I have gained 9 lbs since I stopped driving. Today, I walked 40-mins round trip to day to a doctors appointment rather than arrange for a ride via the county transit.

Open yourself to humor, friendship, and love...I just posted The Husband Store in the "let's lighten up" thread. I heard this joke at the doctor's office. Laughter is good medicine. Laughing at least once a day should be a priority for everyone on planet earth...easy for me to say...right!

Appeal to a higher power...now this is where I can hear my mother on the phone telling me to get back to church (the daughter of an Episcopal Decan and the widow of a Priest). If I would just do that my life problems would be solved. I have a hard time believing this, and I KNOW Peg will come back in here and debate the point with me.

Thanks for this thought provoking thread, Peg I look forward to hearing other opinion of this topic.

[ZucchiniFlower]

The placebo effect is very strong in PD patients, probably because the reward system is located in the basal ganglia, and when given a placebo people still anticipate reward.

I'd love to be able to harness that placebo effect. I wish I knew a mind trick to do that effectively!

[BEMM]

You can think yourself sick to a certain extent, but you can't command a disease to strike you by thoughts of it. Nor can you cure yourself of a disease by thoughts, no matter how positive and happy and brave your thoughts are.
It may be possible to slow down ever so slightly the progression of the disease, though that is very doubtful too. What you absolutely can do by thinking positively as much as you can, is to make life a lot pleasanter for yourself and those around you.
If you are doing well without medicine, you just don't need the medicine yet. You will know when you need it - there will be no doubt in your mind at all when the time has come to get help.

I am a super positive optimist, but my PD progresses at its own speed.

birte

[reverett123]

...on what the cause is. And if there is a complex of causes, then some yes and some no.

With that wimpy preamble- PD has elements from at least four body systems: immune (inflammation), endocrine (stress), gastrointestinal, and neural. These all interact with one another via feedback loops. That means that if you affect one then you affect all because the feedback changes.

We readily see the negative side of that when we get stressed. So it is easy to argue that we can think our self sick.

A while back we talked about a scientist named Gould who found that stress hormones can block our repair systems, so it would seem that our minds can prevent us getting well.

But can positive thoughts trigger changes that initiate healing? I don't know, but I suspect that if we could restrain ourselves enough to stay out of the way of the repair systems that would be a great start. And positive (or negative) thoughts do indeed affect our brain chemistry.

Interesting topic.

[ol'cs]

... that one can at least alter some aquired effects of the PD syndrome. From about one year ago to 4 months ago, I was falling so much that my knees were banged up like a bumper car. Bumps , bruises and lots of bleeding. I wondered why i was falling so much, it was just weird, II'd go down for no reason at inopportune times. I then began to think hard what circuits were being "tricked". I came to the conclusion that I usually fell when i was even for a split second destracted from my walking pace. Someone would ask me a question and down i'd go. I would reach an object in my pathway and down i'd go. ONce i even spread a plate of hot chile all over the front room, rug,walls, ceiling, drapes, tv, boy;. When i was so messed up that i thought thta it was wheelchair time, i just said NO! Now I concentrate on my walking like it is a matter of life and death, i ignore outward audio or other stimulation. When i reach an obstacle i stop, carefully shuffle into a straight pathway, then continue my walking. I've even noticed that lately ,I don't even look for my cane most of the time. THis is a real case of "mind training".

[pegleg]

My friend, Ron Hutton, has about mastered this tricking of the brain. He has a walking stick (cane) always with him. Whenever he freezes up (standing motionless and you cannot move), he turns the handle downward and for some reason when a parkie has a point of reference to step over, the freeze is broken. (I hope you don't mind me telling this, Ron).

And you are right - if we concentrate and block out all external stimuli (an extremely difficult task), we can maneuver much better. I don't know the real reasons for this but have a theory. (Maybe someone can tell me how far off I am).

I know that our brain to body circuitry is all messed up when you have PD. Dopamine is a chemical that helps "conduct" the signal from our brains to a body part. Lack or it, of course, means a worse "connection," sometimes not a connection at all. The reason for the shaking some have is because the chemical mix (dopamine, acetycholine, tyramine, etc) gets excessive at times and produces a power "surge." It is a delicate balance. (How am I doing?)

Since the signals are all mixed up and we take things like moving from point A to point B, this "natural" an fluid movement with a parky just isn't there. Ever notice how one with PD takes wide turns when turning about-face? If you don't you end up on the floor!

So yes, we can make concessions and help ourselves. This is one reason why a physical therapist is a good support service on your healthcare team.

Now, tell me if this is right? BTW cs, you sound a litter more chipper than when you spoke before. I hope so.
Peg

[jeanb]

Peg,

I don't know if it works or not, but at night - especially in bed while trying to fall asleep, I tell my brain to restore and repair. This is my plan to work in conjunction with taking isradipine. I figure maybe maybe I'll help isradipine work in my brain with some positive thinking and visualization. It is worth a try!

[pegleg]

I'll try this. I hope my husband will understand when I sit up in bed and say, "Brain, regenerate!" lol

Thanks

Peggy