My new thread
 

Hi,

1. I called my pdoc's office. I left a message that I am very very depressed and he needs to call me. I might call back in an hour if I do not get a response.

2. I have an appointment with a new tdoc tomorrow Friday at 11:45.
She and I spoke for 2 minutes. She is under my health care plan (this means I get unlimited visits with a small co-pay.) She is 5 miles from my home.
She and I spoke a few minutes on the phone.
I asked how many years she has been practicing, what she does / what I can expect when I see her, and if she has worked with bipolar.
I am trying to be hopeful.

Dealing with insurance and setting up a new therapist is hard and I might need to cry this afternoon.
I told hubby to cut short his time he had planned having fun this afternoon and make sure than he comes home in a couple of hours. He said, o.k.


M

repost: Lexapro vs. Celexa. General stuff on med dosing & side effects
 

Dear Mari

Celexa is citalopram. It contains two molecular "forms" in equal proportions. Only one is therapeutically active. The other was thought to be responsible for some of the side effects.

Lexapro is escitalopram, the therapeutically active component of citalopram.

20 mg Celexa contains: 10mg Lexapro + 10 mg inactive "stuff".

If your insurance covers Lexapro, I'd go with that. Otherwise, Celexa is a valid alternative. I took it before Lexapro was developed. I did fine with it overall.

I preferred Zoloft because I did get a bit of nausea with Celexa. For some, that goes away - I was given an add-on to treat the nausea and was fine. Fwiw, the rationale for the Celexa was that my then-pdoc felt it might be a bit less activating than the Zoloft.

MED SIDE EFFECTS - age - management:

The first few times I took Zoloft I had no major side effects starting or even making large dose adjustments quickly. I think with age my body has become more sensitive. In recent years, I started it on three occasions and had side effects during titration, including headaches and episodes of precordial pain. WHAT HELPED: More gradual titration, not just using smaller dose increments, but especially, more time between changes (2ce as long at each pretherapeutic dose).

--------------------------------------------------

REGARDING "BABY DOSES" - would you consider the oral solution?

http://www.rxlist.com/lexapro-drug.htm
You can use doses and increments as small as 1 mg, if you can measure out 1 mL of product. If the product lacks an adequate measuring cap, you can get a calibrated vial or syringe from the pharmacy.

Celexa also comes in oral solution (2mg/mL) if insurance is an issue.

--------------------------------------------------

i hope this reaches you in time. i saw the posts late d/t migraine. then got dinner summons before i could answer. throw in a browser crash.... :o

lots of hugs to you today. :hug::hug::hug: and good luck :Heart:

waves

hey Mari
 

I hope your pdoc calls back soon Mari

It was courageous of you to set up an appointment with a new tdoc. I hope that goes well.

It's ok to cry. It's perfectly natural under the circumstances.

:hug::hug::hug: :Heart:

waves

Waves,


Thank you.

I must have used up my mental reserves in phone calls.
I do not understand most of this.
I called the pharmacy. Lexapro is generic now and likely covered by my insurance.
Liguid doses sound too hard. What if I use too much?

I read this a few times.
Now I see. They are almost the same drug. Lexapro is newer.

I got paresthesia 10 hours after taking 12.5 mgs Zoloft -- so that is not going to work.

M

I missed his call!
 

Hi,

I had my phone in front of me and I did not pick up. I had too many calls and texts today while I was focusing on hearing from the pdoc.

He called. I did not answer even though I had the phone 6 inches from me. I had it on vibrate.

Arggghhhh!.
What was I thinking!!!!

He only has office hours from 9 to 12 tomorrow.
I probably have to wait until next week to talk to him.

Mari

Oh crap, that's too bad Mari, but you are having a bad patch right now, don't be too hard on yourself over having the phone on vibrate. How are you doing now? :grouphug::hug:

did you get some sleep?
((((HUGS)))
bizi

In truth it occurred to me you might be worried about measuring it. i wonder if you could enlist hubby as a med-buddy to measure this out for you, and perhaps even record the dosage, nightly, . his OCD-proneness would make him a reliably meticulous and accurate measurer and recorder.

you could use the solution just for titration. you will probably work up to 5 mg - and then could switch to pills.

the part that "works" is EXACTLY the same drug. the other part in celexa is non-therapeutic. Lexapro simply lacks that non-working part. I tried to be precise without using chemical terminology. I was afraid that would have been gobbledygook if you aren't familiar with the terms.

yuck. ok. i wasn't sure if you'd tried it. i may have missed it in your post.

mostly, since i've taken it many times over a couple decades, i was relating my experience as to:
-- absence of side effects when i was younger
-- presence of bothersome side effects in recent years, during titration
-- what i found helpful to reduce discomfort during titration.

I posted that because in the past when you've tried AD's, i've seen you start out slow, and then get impatient about having the drug work yesterday, and decide to ramp it up and either "deal" or chuck it. the result so far has been the latter. in some cases a drug still may not be tolerable, but it is well documented that faster titration = more likelyhood of s/e, and increased likelyhood of drug d/c. my recent issues when i started zoloft were sort of a testimonial to that. ;)

i hope you manage to talk to pdoc tomorrow. sorry you had your phone off. stuff like that happens. :o :hug::hug::hug:

waves

I don't know that much about the difference between the two.

I do know that my son Devin took Lexapro for depression and
panic attacks. And it worked.

I take Celexa for anxiety and depression. That started the depression
after my husband got laid off, and has started the money issues so
much stronger.
It works for me.:hug:

Donna

I cannot do this.

Everything is too hard.
I would like to cancel the appt.

I remember about 10 or 12 years ago going to a new therapist for two sessions when I was in major sleep fog at both visits -- I could barely sit up. She asked questions about my sleep and I told her I did not want to talk about it.

Mari

I am so sorry that this is so hard for you.
Will you be able to call your pdoc in the morning....they will probably be closed after noon like most doctors offices are.
I believe in you.
you can do this.
((((((HUGS))))))
bizi

Bizi,

Right. He used to work afternoons only on Thursdays. His schedule has changed now that he also works at the state mental hospital some mornings.

I do not know if he and I can connect on the phone Friday.
I will be sleeping in the morning.
He might call late morning or right after 12:00 --- but during that time I will be in the appt with the therapist.

Oh, God. I hope she is a nice person.
I feel so much stress right now.
I do not know how it is that I have deteriorated so much.

Mari

Waves,

Hubby could do the measuring if he understood the stakes involved in getting it wrong. He is sloppy unless he feels something is important. Most of the time, things outside of his sphere are not important.
Maybe I could teach him and then supervise. Gah! That would all be so stressful but as you point out it would only be for a few days.

Most likely I will make an appt to talk to the pdoc about the meds options. He and I have gone through most of the SSRIs already. Because I was on Lexapro at 10 mgs per day for three days and did not experience paresthesia, I am willing to re-consider it at tiny doses.

And what happens is that the depression makes thinks worse. Even when I was not as depressed as I am now, I was depressed enough to feel completely lost when the side effects kicked in before the benefit kicked in. I would usually have to stop the side effects (and thus the med) in order to be able to get up in the morning and function at work. Right now, I have some space in time to try meds. I hope I am up to dealing with them.

In my 20s I was brave despite the depression and had trust in myself and the system. I feel knocked down now.
I wonder if pdoc would prescribe Srattera (an NRI) in tiny doses. (I know it is sometimes used off label.) The stuff in the sample pack mdoc gave me is in huge doses.

Yes. I understand.

(My writing/typing/thinking is off these days. I hope that I am making myself understood.)

M

You are making sense. Good luck with the tdoc today Mari.

I know you can do this. I have faith in you.

Will be looking for a update tonight.

Donna:grouphug::hug:

Mari good luck with appointment
 

Hi Mari

Yes your posts are clear.

Re dosing of an oral solution (for any med, if you went that route) ... I think you can probably do a good job convincing hubby of stakes involved in getting things wrong, and in terms of the impact on him.

Mostly I am posting to wish you well with your new tdoc today. I hope she is a warm, kind person and that she is very gentle with you today. I hope too that she is willing to defer getting into the sleep thing. She certainly might ask - it is a natural question - and if you chose to keep her as a T she would need to be brought up to speed on that, but it doesn't have to be today.

I will be back when I can, to check on you. I have a bad headache today that only partly responded to meds. :o Also my internet connection has been flaky - (provider side). But I'm keeping you in my thoughts and sending good vibes.

And hugs :hug::hug::hug:

waves

I think you are very clear in your posts here Mari. I am glad you have us to talk to and that you have hubby to help you. :) Please keep us posted on how it goes. :) ♥

checking...
 

Hi Mari

i've been checking to see how things went today.

you are probably exhausted. or maybe just not up to posting.

i hope that you are ok. :circlelove:

((((((((( hugs )))))))))

waves

new tdoc
 

Hi,

On Thursday when I called I asked her if she worked with people with bipolar. She explained some things that sounded good. She said we might spend two sessions . .. . {something I cannot remember exactly but I understood that she figured we would need 1.5 to 2 sessions to get to know each other}.

On Friday, she was friendly and smiled a lot and I felt at ease.
She covered a lot of ground without making me feel grilled:
how long dx'd, any hospitalizations, any others in family dx'd , . . .

When I told her that every psychologist said the sleep thing was a medical issue and every MD said it was a psychological issue, she said that it is probably a little of both. She said that we can talk more about how maybe I am too hard on myself about sleep and how maybe we can find ways to deal with how I feel about lack of sleep.
I left her office hopeful.


I have an appointment with pdoc in his office on Thursday/ May 23.
I have the second appointment with this new tdoc on Friday/ May 31.

Mari

Mari

I'm so glad this sounds so uplifting for you.

I believe you are taking a step that you needed to.

Donna:grouphug::hug:

I am glad that she was nice.
bizi

Hi Mari, :)

The visit with the new tdoc sounded pretty good. I'm glad it gave you a feeling of hope and that you have another appointment. She definitely sounds worth a try. And her approach sounds gentle.

:hug::hug::hug:

waves

Glad to hear things seem a little better and more hopeful for you Mari! :D This new tdoc sounds great! I have always wondered if your sleeping issues weren't a bit of both, physically and psychologically based, so maybe with this new tdoc's approach you'll finally get some relief! :grouphug:

hey Mari
 

Dear Mari

How are you doing?

I've been thinking of you. I hope you are feeling at least somewhat better, if not more.

((((hugs))))

waves

not sure how I feel . . .. mostly crummy
 

Hi,


Saturday the cleaning lady was here.
I spent three hours or more putting my messes into piles that are logical so I can return to them to finish putting away /throwing away.
I got stuff accomplished and my surroundings are less chaotic.

Tuesday I have a meeting in the afternoon and afterwards I will drive through traffic to Whole Foods to buy laundry soap.
I absolutely have to use unscented products for everything.
In a crunch last week I bought this lemon scented one hoping that I could tolerate it:
http://www.mrsmeyers.com/product/Lem...ent/155665.uts
It smells awful. Maybe Whole Foods will have what I need but I hate to go there because it is a huge driving hassle AND the CEO and is a jerk and some folks are boycotting Whole Foods for his political craziness.

===
I am trying to deal.
I feel stuck.

Mari

Good to hear from you, Mari
 

Dear Mari

It sounds like you had a very productive weekend but it sounds like it was tiring too. When i feel yucky, it does help me to have less chaotic surroundings. I hope the clearer environment helps soothe you.

You sound sort of like ... you just landed somewhere unexpectedly and are still a bit disoriented? the dust will settle. you will feel better. You sound a little better in your posts... but still very tentative. That is understandable. Take the day as it comes. take it a minute at a time. Or a moment at a time. Maybe keep some plain water handy to sip. That helps me sometimes.

I believe in you. I believe you will make it through today, and tomorrow, and this week. But let's just get through today for now.

(((hugs)))

waves

laundry detergent
 

Hi Mari

I am not always bothered by all perfumes/odors, but i can relate because some smells always bother me and at times, all smells bother me.

I was a bit surprised you don't have scent-free laundry products available in a nearby store, but then here too i notice even some rather large chain stores each sell a limited selection... it can be hard to find a specific thing.

i did a quick google search and found an online soap store www.soap.com ... i don't know if this is helpful. here is the link directly to the fragrance free laundry det section:

http://www.soap.com/subcat=Laundry-5...Fragrance-Free

standard shipping is $4.99, for a typical 2 day delivery.
cost is waived on orders $35 and above.

there are other online stores too, including walmart.com. the walmart site lists several perfume-and-dye-free products by major brands eg: Tide, All. can you get to a walmart easily? If one is accessible, the store can be selected on the website and its products browsed online, to ensure they have what you seek before going there. do you use a specific brand/product?

let me know if i can do anything more concrete to get you out of that horrific sounding drive to Whole Foods. i am feeling ok and could easily do some web browsing for you to help you find what you need.

waves

Waves,

Thank you for the link.
I use Seventh Generation for dish soap. That is available in Publix and most of the time I can get scent free.
Many years ago I used Tide Free because it was the best I could get but it still has some smell and it is loaded with chemicals that have adverse affects.

As few as six years ago I could only get laundry soap on-line. In our last apt, teenagers once stole my mail and that made getting laundry soap especially fraught.

The Walmart near me did not have the scent free products. I did buy Baking Soda from them and Some Borax powder --- both that help keep the washing machine clean (I am almost getting a flashback as I write because hubby has issues with his laundry being JUST RIGHT -- laundry seems to be a potential source of anxiety for each of us but then anxiety is like depression . . . . if one is susceptible to it, one finds it popping up everywhere.)

Mari

Seventh Generation website?
 

I have been hemhawing how to reply.

Not sure if you wanted me to look into Seventh Generation, and if you are also looking for their laundry det (you mention dish det). They do have a web site which allows you to browse products and locate retailers by product line and zip code. The main site is www.seventhgeneration.com.

Their free and clear laundry det is available in different sizes and 2x or 4x concentrations.

----------------
Below is the URL to get search results for Free & Clear retailers, within a 20 mile range of zip XXXXX. Highlight, copy, and paste into your browser - replace the XXXXX's with your zip code of interest - then hit enter (or whatever to make your browser go to the URL).

URL (link is not "live"):

http://www.seventhgeneration.com/where-to-buy/product-finder?filter0=XXXXX&op0=20&product=freeclear

It's easy to change zip, product lines, or mile range from the search page. You get a listing of retailers w/ address & phone and stock info.

I'd probably call any place you're interested in to check they have the right stuff as the search lets you choose "laundry products" or "free and clear products" but not both.

FYI I tried some actual zips: lots of Publix & Winn Dixie's, couple Targets, and a Walgreens.
----------------

Maybe i hemhawed too long and you've already headed to Whole Foods. well this looks like a recurrent hassle for you anyway, so maybe this will turn out useful eventually if not today. ordering directly from seventhgeneration looks very expensive.

waves

Waves,

I really should not post as the posts do not make sense. I am sorry.
What is available in the stores changes. . . and seems arbitrary.

Sometimes, I can less easily get soap that I want than I could years ago.
Years ago the soap also also came scent free --- because who would add scents to natural soaps!!??
Now the soaps are showing up in the stores with scents. Some scents I can almost handle (I remember a dish soap that was almond), but things like lavender feel noxious.
But serioiuslu, I have to stock up and buy ahead of time because the availabilty on the shelf changes from week to week.

And dish soap is way more available than laundry soap.


===

I went to Whole Foods and got a bunch of laundry soap. Now I can hope that hubby is not heavy handed with it (he does his own clothes).

M

Waves,

This is helpful.

I might start ordering soap via mail so I do not have to depend on whatever is going on with trucking and / or shelf stocking.
These stores listed do theoretically carry the product but they are not going to have it on the shelf each time that I walk in the store.

And people working in the stores and the supply chain who are not sensitive do not see what the big deal is. Scent Free soap is merely another product.

It seems that I have to make better plans.

Mari

Walgreens - for online purchase of Seventh Gen products!
 

don't worry. i know you aren't feeling good.

In this case... buying online might not cost that much more, if at all. I just saw that Seventh Gen doesn't stock all of their own products (eg bulk sizes), also their shipping costs suck, BUT...

Walgreens offers the full range of S.G products online, cheaper, and with much cheaper shipping! $5.?? for orders < $25, FREE if more. Small surcharges apply to all orders exceeding 20lbs. The delivery times are 2-7 days.

http://www.walgreens.com/search/resu...h%20generation

In the above search I ticked laundry det, dish dets, and bathroom cleaners... you can "filter" products different ways.

Hehe, yes I hope hubby uses it sparingly.

I am glad you got what you needed and now you are set and won't have to deal with this for a while. :)

ok so, at this stage, I will quit bombarding you with links. ;)

Rest up well for tomorrow.

:hug::hug::hug:

waves

Waves,

Thanks for helping me with the soap.
Things like soap seem trivial -- except when they are not I suppose.


Has the Lost program run its course?
I recently returned to it and completed season 3 and season 4 episode 1.

I remember that the last episode of season 3 was a game changer where we saw Jack in the future.

In Season 4 Episode 1 The Beginning of the End the Losties split into the to camps of Jack and Locke. This really was the beginning of the end the first time I watched this because I hated seeing the groups separate even though it was a good guess to expect that they would reconfigure again.

Are you in Season 5?
M

Mari

I stopped watching LOST.

waves

my pdoc is off my plan
 

Hi,


Pdoc is no longer covered under my insurance plan.
His office person called to tell me that my visit tomorrow / Thursday would cost $175.00.

Wow.
Change.

Mari

when it rains it pours, with thunder and lightning too
 

:Noooo:

geez. couldn't he wait till you felt better? :(

do you know yet, whether you will stay with him out of pocket for now, or look for someone else right away?

:hug::hug::hug:

waves

It might be that the insurance plan dropped him.

phone calls
 

This is what I have so far:

-- A nurse practitioner
-- One person who graduated from a med school in Santo Domingo
-- One person who graduated from a med school in Havana
-- One person who graduated from a school in the mid West and not taking new patients
-- One person who graduated from a school in Mumbai, India


I called one MD and the office person said that the first appointment is in June which I guess is o.k. because we are near the end of May. I will think about this . . . . have to run an errand and then get back to the phone.

Mari

true. sorry, i didn't intend to be blameful. :o

i just meant to remark on the timing - rephrase: "couldn't this happen when you were feeling better?"

i personified it. it's actually more likely the ins dropped him. or a combination like, he raised his rates and as a result the ins dropped him. either way it's only (co)incidental to your state of being ... but the timing does suck.

does this mean you are not going to tomorrow's appointment, or is the jury out on out on that for now?

I understand.
It does suck.
I was focused on making some progress.