I forgot to add that her behaviour has been like this without meds....

I have noticed that she has regressed.... meds have made no difference.

She has had a hearing test... some preliminary testing ..

At her appt with psychologist dd had a meltdown and cried for 25 minutes just because she said she was "hungry" she had eaten lunch before she left.

Her behaviour is that of a 2-3 yr old..... will sob if you say no to something... easily frustrated... covers her ears alot when there is a sound she doesn't like.... she is a very fearful child...

She hates crowds, has panic attacks etc.


She has been violent with me... i caught her with scizzors... she a piece of her hair because she was angry... she turned the toaster on because she wanted to see how it worked...

:hug: Cindy :hug:

I'm so sorry you're going through these trials. I can only imagine how frustrating it must feel. Your family is in my prayers and I hope Haylee can receive the treatment she deserves and needs.

You go MOM!:D

There were times I would have to throw mine over my shoulder and leave public places. Otherwise, I would have had to drag her out of stores. I quit taking her to restaurants. Many times I got 'looks' from people who were 'better than me'. All of this may have caused ME some social axiety <grin>.

Adjustments will have to be made for everyone, but your dreams most likely will come true for her. When they grow up, they learn to be good citizens, they mature, learn to control themselves...as long as you are prepared for the fight. Sounds like you are :)

By the way, My DD was like this without meds too. The meds made her hysterical. No matter what her dx turns out to be, behavior modification will most likely be a part of the solution. Every thing you are listing, just make her sound more and more like mine.
Hang in there! :hug:

EDIT: Mine took a knife once and cut her arm in front of me. She said she hated me. This hs all changed.....

Cindy:

Risperdal is an anti-psychotic med that is often precribed for people with schizophrenia. But they also give it to people who have pychotic episodes.

They gave it to my son (after he moved away). when he left Arizona, he would get on a bus (with a free bus voucher), he would land in yet another city, get off the bus, dial 911 and someone from a crisis center would pick him up and bring him some place, feed him, house him, or they would put him in the psych ward for evaluation. Sometimes the evaluation would last 3 days, sometimes 2 weeks. I would often talk to the nurses on duty and absolutely every one of them would tell me. "The emergency room is filled with people like your son". (My son would phone me and say "hey, I did it again, I got a room and food and they even have a nintendo system here". He was 20 years old at the time.

I found out they had given him Risperdal because of his behavior. It did nothing to change his behavior. He did what he wanted to do. when he stopped doing the bus thing, they put him in an apartment complex, and he was on risperdal, prosac, and god knows what else he was on.

He gained a lot of weight from the Risperdal and told them he wanted off of it. They weaned him off of it. He was diagnosed with Aspergers at age 21 by a doctor who looked at his behavior, looked at his compulsiveness, and watched him for 2 weeks, coming to the conclusion that "you have aspergers".

We had absolutely never heard of this disorder until my son called us up and said "Guess what, I know what's wrong with me, I have aspergers disorders".

This was after being diagnosed with ADD, ADHD, Oppositional Defiance disorder, Narcissistic Personality disorder, Bi-polar, you name it. He had been diagnosed with it.

The one doctor said "no, you don't have any of those things, you have aspergers".

He is also a compulsive gamber, extremely addicted to virtual online worlds and doesn't get off of the computer. He takes care of himself, he comes and goes as he pleases and won't listen to authority.

He also acted EXACTLY like your daughter did when we would take him anywhere. If you said no to him, he would have a meltdown. And I mean a meltdown. He was also put on Ritalin, and we were told he had ADD, ADHD, etc.etc. Many people with Aspergers are given this diagnosis early in life because doctors DO NOT understand Aspergers disorder.

I for one, do not know IF my son has aspergers or not. I am not in the loop. He is 26 years old, does not have to attend any kind of therapy.

They used to make him go to group therapy, one on one therapy sessions (the therapist terminated that because whatever she tried to do, he was not willing to change, or see anybody else's way of thinking).

Please understand, I have absolutely no idea what your daughter has. I am telling you my story, just so you know that you are absolutely not alone in what you are going through.

I do however, sincerely believe that behavior modification is the way to go. Kids with aspergers are being treated with a treatment procedure known as ABA. Applied Behavior Analysis.

I only wish someone would have done this for my son when he was 6 or 7 or even 8. Maybe we might still have our child in our life.

I met up with a Behavior Specialist two weeks ago in my husband's Orthopedic Surgeon's waiting room. We were all there chatting in the waiting room, and this guy was listening to me talk about aspergers with another woman in the room, who had a nephew who was 13 and was recently diagnosed with Aspergers. He was driving everybody crazy with not listening, not following rules, and you couldn't say no to him. He would have a meltdown. (sound familiar?).

That's when the guy next to me tapped me on the shoulder and said "you'll never guess what I do for a living, I'm a behavioral therapist, and I work with children who have Aspergers, Autism Spectrum Disorders, ADD and ADHD, and Pervasive Development Disorder NOS (not otherswise specified).

He said "you have no idea how we change these kids lives. And the lives of their parents". "But we have to get them early". I wish I could tell you that there is hope fo your son". I immediately said "Oh, I know, he's a gambler, he is lost in his virtual reality world and that's a done deal". He sadly nodded and said 'yes".

But he said "when we get the young ones, and we work with them.". Well, he went on to say that he actually had an autistic (see, experts say that Aspergers is a mild form of autism but is NOTHING like a regular autistic kid who stares and does nothing). The brain is just wired differently. They do not like to follow orders, take direction and they think they know everything. They want their way ALL THE TIME.

He then went on to speak about one of his young patients (a child with regular autism) "I had a kid who did nothing, just stared, and flapped and walked on his toes". I said 'oh, walking on the toes is one of the indicators of autism right?" and he said "right".

He said 'well, I worked with this kid (he was 3). He worked with this kid and this kid went from being severely autistic, flapping, not responding, to now being in a regular kindergarten, completely different from the way he was at 2 or 3 years old.

It took years, and the ABA but with the behavioral therapy, kids are re-routed to react in a certain way. Many people don't go for this, they think it's some kind of brain-washing mechanism.

But if I had known about ABA when my son was younger and doing his meltdowns, and getting kicked out of every after school program because of his behavior and getting kicked out of Karate Class because the Karate teacher asked him to do something and my son refused, and the Karate teacher started to reprimand him, well all hell broke loose. They gave us back our money and the guy told me "your son is mentally ill".

This is the same son who got 100's on every test, aced all the citywide tests getting the highest marks on everything, got a full scholarship to college and made the deans list.

Yeah, I definitely would have done the ABA thing.

But no one knew 26 years ago about Aspergers.

People know more now. They know what to look for.

Not saying that your daughter is autistic, aspergers, bi-polar, or whatever.

But you know there IS SOMETHING going on inside her brain. The wiring is crossed. You have to find a way to criss-cross that wiring. Might not happen, but you will try. I know you. You will try.

When you find that behavioral therapist (and absolutely, the whole family has to get involved). you just might have a good chance that she can live a normal productive life. She just has to learn self discipline, she has to learn that when someone says "no" to her, that she cannot act any way she wants to.

Her meltdowns are the resulte of her being under so much stress that she simply does not know what to do. So she has a meltdown.

This might be acceptable behavior at 2 or 3, maybe even at 7. But I'll tell you, as she gets older, IT IS NOT ACCEPTABLE BEHAVIOR and it will be her undoing.

I'm telling you this a mother who has been through it all.

We had our kid in therapy from the time he was 7. We did the family therapy bit also.

ONLY IT WAS THE WRONG KIND OF THERAPY. It was not behavioral therapy. We never had the correct diagnosis. When you have the correct diagnosis and you do the correct therapy (as a family unit), and the child understands that Mom and Dad make the rules, and the kid has to follow the rules, and the brain is wired to accept this fact, and by repeating and repeating (that's what ABA teaches). They use the reward system, they make a child know that certain types of behavior is not acceptable, and good behavior is rewarded.

It's all in the way it's presented to the child. And the child must know that she must comply or there will be consequences.

Do you want to hear a funny story? When my son was 8 and we took him to yet another therapist, this therapist listened to us telling her about his meltdowns, that whenever we took him anywhere and we said no to one of his demands, that he would kick and scream and we had to leave the place, WELL you won't believe what she told us. She said "go out and buy him all new clothes, and new toys, he doesn't feel loved". I just looked at my husband and said 'is she kidding??" He doesn't feel loved??? He's our only child, we love him to death"

But we did as we were told. We went out and bought him all the clothes, and a new game system.

Boy, was that a mistake. That taught him, "have a meltdown and you can get anything you want".

So believe me on this one. No matter what the diagnosis, and whether or not it can be treated with meds, or just therapy alone, there is always a chance that whatever the wiring problem in her brain, well THERE ARE ALWAYS OPTIONS.

You have to go through all the routes, complete physicals to rule out allergies, you have to look at family history to see if any other family members displayed any similar characteristics, (some things are genetic in nature), then when this is all ruled out, her behavior is observed under strict conditions.

I know many people who had to leave the kid in a controlled environment so the evaluators could evaluate her (without the parents present), so they could get a completely unbiased and clear picture of the child's behavior). Of course the parents didn't want to leave the child in a strange hospital facility. But they ultimately had no choice. The child's behavior was wearing them down.

If this is what you need to do, then you need to do it.

A hard road, I know. But there is hope.

Remember what the behavioral therapist told me in the waiting room.

He took an autistic kid and he is now in regular kindergarten playing with regular kids, and acting perfectly normal.

There is a light at the end of your tunnel. You just have to keep following it.!!!

Wow Melody! What a story!! I have to go research aspergers disorders....Thanks for the enlightening post!!

Its a better world today when it comes to fixing whats wrong with our kids.

Jeannie

Melody, Greenjeans,


Thank you sooo much for sharing your stories... it has given me the information that will be extremely helpful to me.

Reading your stories it sounds exactly like my dd....

I am encouraged to know that there is hope with the proper help... as a family we DO need to have the therapy... it's been SO difficult as a family because we don't know how to handle the meltdowns... we are always walking on eggshells..


We also dread functions where we have to attend as a family because dd will always have a meltdown...

It would make the world of difference to have the tools to help her so that we can function as a family.

Her older brothers 17 &13 worship her and are so patient with her but it gets difficult for them. They don't know how to handle her when she has a meltdown, as a result I am with her 24/7.

When I have errands to run or doctor's appt etc she comes with me....
I can not leave her home with her brothers she will take off and leave when she has a meltdown and that is not safe. I don't trust her.

I am looking forward to the day where can laugh and enjoy life the way it's supposed to be enjoyed without the fears, anxieties etc..

She is missing out on so many levels it makes me sad .. no friends... no school experience... and the list goes on..

She sees her pediatrician on Tues so i will find out if a should discontinue the ritalin.

It's funny viewing old video of her as in infant/toddler and she would engage you with smiles and typical behaviour but now it seems like someone flipped a switch and she is not the same girl.

I have noticed that she plays with toys in ways that were not intended, for example she has beads that she has to make braclets etc, well she will have all the beads in a cookie tin and she will put a small doll in with them and she will talk to the beads, she won't use them for jewelry.

At halloween she would separate the candy, as far as lollipops, chocolate and she would sort them and talk to them... we thought it was weird at the time but she has done that for a couple years now... she will play with them for hours....

When she is writing she won't write using letters, she would just do weird symbols almost like a bunch of loops .. she knows how to write but won't.


It is a stressful life with trying to get out of limboland etc...but i'm confident that we will find get to were we need to go.

My DD Behavior specialist said she would never be a writer...to get her a keyboard and fast! She now types 80wpm LOL!! (Did you notice things were different when she was a baby even? Cried more? Couldn't comfort her? That was my DD early on)

The thing with behavior modification is it goes completely against the 'normal' way of rearing a child. Consequenses and punishment are the wrong method. I know, I know, it does not make sense!

You are taught to praise, praise and praise some more. Getting more excited than normal when they do things right. You FOCUS on the good and IGNORE the bad. (This of course does not work in public at first) They begin to learn that the only way to get your attention, is to be good! What do we do when they have a meltdown? We get firm, dicipline, time outs, etc. They get the attention they seek. IT WILL NOT WORK FOR THESE KIDS.

I think Melody's story is important because she did not get the right help she saught when her DS was a child. I was lucky and got the right help. You can see the difference in how things came out...our kids are both adults now and the difference is noted. Of course, Melody started trying to get help 10 years before I did. I doubt they had Behavior Mod in those days....Your child being 12 years younger than mine hopefully means there are even better solutions today.

My DD can still throw a tantrum, but as an adult I can now tell her "Don't talk to me that way!" STOP IT! If she dosen't get her way, the world ends. BUT...she knows this about herself now, accepts it....and will chill almost on command. :)

I remember thinking years ago, I wish she would just grow up and be gone, I couldn't deal with it another second....but as the program began to stick, the changes became evident....changed our lives.

Also, she never really did fit in a normal school. I put her in a self paced program called SAVE here. She excelled, graduated a year early...these kids are SMART. They just need a different approach.

I'm so glad you are feeling better. Look me up if you want to talk more as you go thru these doctors and changes. Be prepared for the fight, don't give up. Also....the key word you will learn is "Consistancy". You'll learn more about that....you may think you are now...but you'll see that these kids need MORE of it.

I bet when your DD is not freaking out, she is just a bundle of love, deep compassion and brillliant. Oh...my DD would play similar to yours as well...and had few friends growing up...but now? TONS of friends. Very popular!

Cry the tears now and again...I did...but it does not have to be this way, and I bet a year from now, you'll see a change...one you can all live with. Maybe even go shopping again someday! :D Us Mommy's need that with our DD!!! It's a passage of life!

Check out a book store on line...find some books about Behavior Modification, start learning this weekend. It will be a great relief to you...and you'll feel better knowing you will have control of this situation sooner....

You sound like a good Mommy :D

Jeannie:

The reason I shared what I did, was that so many moms and dads are going through such pain and stuff with their kid's behaviors that they truly don't know what to make of it. I know I didn't.

We did absolutely everything we were told to do, by EVERY THERAPIST we were told to do it by. EVERYTHING!!!

I'll even share one more painful moment with you. This is a long post, but this stuff has to be shared if we are ever going to help one another. We need to find coping strategies and better methods of reaching our children (so we don't lose them later on in life).

When we saw yet another therapist (this was a guy named Ron who was a Pastor), and we did the family therapy thing, well, he also saw Alan and I separately.

I must have looked dead or something, I was absolutely exhausted from all the meltdowns. Alan just sat there, completely clueless.

Ron looked at Alan and said "can't you see what your wife is going through, can't you see that she needs you to take a more active approach in your son's life, can't you take him to the park, can't you do ANYTHING with him??"

Alan responded "no I can't". Now I'm not saying that Alan's lack of parenting skills had anything to do with my son's behavior. What I am saying is that my son's behavior had everything to do with my husband's backing off of parental responsibility. My son exhausted us. His constant demands, his constant need to be the center of our universe, well my husband was almost 40, worked his head off, and was tired, and I figured "why the heck can't he take him to the park and throw a baseball with him??" As if that would make my son change his behavior!!!

But we did learn in therapy that we had to use discipline. We took stuff away, (that did not work), we restricted tv time (that did not work). My husband took him to school, and picked him up (this is before he took the school bus, as he got older) What a nightmare that turned out to be, All these kids were hooligans, beating up on each other. My son came home once with a punched out lip and we had to go to school the next day. The parents were moritified. I have no idea if my son provoked anyone but you don't think of these things, you only see your son with a punched up lip and you go crazy.

So there we were in therapy and I must have really looked drained and I remember Ron telling Alan "you must step up to the plate as a father, you must DO THIS". And I remember Alan asking "what the heck do I do"

Get a load of this one (AND NOBODY YELL AT ME, BECAUSE THIS WAS A THERAPIST TELLING US WHAT TO DO, WE DIDN'T DO THIS OFF OF THE TOP OF OUR HEADS, WE WEREN'T RAISED TO BELIEVE THIS WAS RIGHT)

Ron said; "The next time you son has a meltdown, take a hairbrush and use the hairbrush on his behind, your son needs to know that you mean business".

Now remember this, the previous therapist told us to go out and buy clothes and toys, and now this guy is telling us to use a hairbrush.

But since this guy was a pastor, who were we to disagree and nothing else was working on the meltdowns, tantrums, call it what you want, he was acting out horribly and was not easy to love, believe me.

Ron went onto explain: (I'll never forge this, it's imprinted on my memory).

He said: "The hand is used to express love, so never hit a kid with your hand, use a hairbrush, so the hairbrush is doing the hitting, not the hand".

We just looked at him. I'm thinking "this guy wants me to beat my son with a hairbrush". I asked him and he said "no, not you, his father, he has to respect and fear his father". But not the hand, you must use a hairbrush.

If you think this was easy to hear, believe me it was HARDER TO IMPLEMENT.

But the time came. My son was about 8 at the time. He had been kicked out of every day camp, our of every after school program, out of Karate school (he was carried out kicking and screaming, etc.). We had HAD IT!!!

So one day, he was having a fit in his bedroom. My husband looked at me, got the hairbrush, and did his thing.

Guess what happened??? From the age of 8 till he was 15 or 16, my son never had another meltdown or tantrum. He also got himself out of Special ed.

He was put there after kindergarten because of his behavior. He was put in something called Sci 7 (for emotionally disturbed kids). 7 kids in a class with a teacher and a para.

After that beating (and yes, I call it a beating), and I would NEVER TELL ANY PARENT TO DO THIS, I'm just sharing our experience.

Well, he never had a tantrum. He also told me one day (he was in the 3rd grade). He said "i'm tired of being with these crazy kids, I want to be mainstreamed". I said 'are you out of your mind, you can't control yourself in a bigger classroom, you know how you used to get". and he replied "I know exactly what I'm doing, tell them to mainstream me" So I requested that they mainstream him. This meant for a few hours each day, they take the kid out of special ed and put him in a normal classroom environment for few hours every day. They observe his behavior and if they see him improve, they put him permanently in regular classes (with resource room study groups after school ends).

So that's exactly what happened. My son went from being in Special Ed from first grade to the 3rd Grade to getting into regular 4th Grade Classroom.

I will never forget what happened. There was no acting out. But he did not socialize with the other kids. They thought him somewhat odd. He was chubby, and they often made fun of him. He did have some friends though.

I remember he got 100 on every test. Then the citywide math test was given. I was waiting to hear the result and the class was outside playing on some warm afternoon. Frank was running around with some kids and I remember thinking "this is how it's supposed to be, they are laughing and running around". I approached his teacher and I said "did he do okay in the citywide Math Test".

The guy looks at me and says "Did he do alright??? are you for real, he scored the highest of anyone in NYC in the Math division". I said "he did what"??? and he laughed and said: "He fools you, he looks out the window like he is not paying attention and you think he's daydreaming, but he is soaking up everything I'm teaching in the class and he remembers everything". (My son never got less than 100 on any test he was given, and as a matter of fact he would get 110 on some tests. I remember thinking 'who the heck gets 110 on a test, the highest number you can get is 100, right?' Well, no it's not right. It seems that if they give you a bonus question, you get more points.

So the teacher says "your son is a genius, I only wish he would apply this as he grows up".

So this genius, grew up (not to have anymore meltdowns), but did grow up to shoplift, make the wrong kind of friends, oh, I must tell you this story.

When he was 12 and in Junior High School, he was a big chubby kid. Well, there was this little jerk in his classroom. It's always the jerks who pick on the older, bigger chubbier ones, so they can exclaim, "hey I kicked up on the fat kid".

So this jerk picked on my son, for 3 months (wait until you hear how this story ends). He called my son names for 3 months straight. Every single day. The teacher observed this. Of course the teacher couldn't do anything, what can they do. They can speak to the jerk or his parents, but when the kids are in the school ground, who knows what happens, right??

Well, after 3 months of taking this and not doing a darn thing, my son calmly went over to the jerk, picked him up (while he was still sitting in the desk), picked him up, desk and all, and threw him into the blackboard.

Of course I was called up by the teacher and guess what he said:

I don't blame your son one bit. He used such restraint for 3 months while this other kid acted like a jerk. I am not writing your son up on this. I don't want this to be on his record. The kid had it coming.

I think these experiences in life bring us to where we finally become.

Parents have no clue what is going on in schools. I never knew.

When I questioned my son on this and asked him "why didnt' you tell us?" he said 'now what would you have done, gone to school, fought my battles for me". I took care of it." He was 12.

Now guess what happened when he was 13??

I was called to the school by the dean of discipline because my son had pushed a security guard. MY SON HAD PUSHED A SECURITY GUARD??? Was he kidding? My son hadn't had a meltdown, since he was 8, and he never pushed anyone in authority. I figured maybe the guy did something, but I was not about to accuse anyone of anything until I got the facts.

So I walked the 5 blocks to the school.

I show up in the deans office, and there was my 13 year old 5 foot 8 son sitting among the various deans and there was the security guard. I was the only woman in the room.

I sat down and said "Please tell me what happened"

My son was sitting all gloomy and defiant in the chair. I said "sit up straight" He complied. They all looked at me.

I said "what happened?" The security guard told the story.

My son got to school late and there's a rule that if you get to school later than 8:45 a.m. you can't go in the regular door, you have to go and get a late pass, and my son didn't want to go through all this so he shoved his way by the security guard.

I then looked at my son and said "did you do this"? and he defiantly said; "yeah so what if I did". This was new stuff going on here, he had never spoken to me before like this, so I knew immediately that he was again challenging authority and needed to be set straight. Now what was going on in the other offices? All the mothers were being called into the school because their sons were caught stealing this and that and I could hear all of the other mothers saying "I don't believe you, my son would not do that, or my daughter would not do that". THIS WAS NOT ME.

I believed then, as I believe now, that you have to make people accountable, I don't care what the age.

I looked at my son and I said 'what do you think you now have to do". He said glumly "i have to apologize". So I said "so do it". He just said in a stupid beligerant voice "I'm sorry".

I got up, I walked over to my son, I yanked him up by his collar, (he is bigger than I am), I marched him over to the security guard and I said 'what are you saying"?? and he again said (with the correct tone).

I"m sorry, I never should have pushed you". You should have seen the look on the faces of the Security Guard and the people in the room.

I then said to all of them "what's his punishment"? and one of them said (as a question to me). "Well, is it okay if we suspend him for the day". (Like this is a punishment, sending him home so he can watch tv????)

So I said "fine, send him home, he'll wash windows". They then told him to sit outside so we can talk.

They then said "we would like to commend you, we have never seen a mother do what you just did". I said "what did I do??" He said "look over at the other offices (that's when I heard all the mothers saying "my son would never do that".

I got the point.

So we walked home and my son thought it was hilarious. He said "mom, take it easy". I said "take it easy". I told him "MY mother never had to be called to school by any dean of discipline". "you are going to wash windows".

He washed windows.

I wish I could tell you this had a happy ending. Oh, the rest of the school year was really uneventful and he went to high school. But the first two weeks in high school, well he had an accident around the corner from where we live, and had some bad cuts to his forehead. But he recovered. His friends and the neighbors came over to visit but he just wanted to stay in his room. That's when he really changed (after the age of 14). The shi* hit the fan when he was 15 or 16. There was no indication of this building up in him. He went to school, came home, got 100s on everything. He didn't make any friends because he didn't fit the stereotype of kid. He wasn't a jock, he wasn't athletic. He just came home and stayed on the computer and because he didn't give us any trouble (like all my friend's kids, who drank, did drugs etc), who were we to complain. He went to school, he did have one or two friends) and he didn't stay out late at night.

I am shariing this with all of you so you moms who go through this, know you are not alone.

One day, my son buys a fishing pole from a friend for $10.00. There was no place to go fishing so there was no reason to spend his allowance on any old dumb fishing pole.

But kids do stupid things. We all do.

My husband comes home to find our son and his friend doing the deal over the fishing pole. My husband says "this is the most ridiculous thing I have every seen, give back the $10.00, there is no place to go fishing, so why on earth are you buying a fishing pole?"

My son refused to do this. My husband just put his hand on the fishing pole. That's all he did. He didn't threaten my son, he didn't touch my son.

Well, all hell broke loose. My son and he tussled over the pole, and the top of the pole broke. My son's brain also broke. He went after my husband threatening to kill him. (I was visiting a sick aunt at the time, but I was told this by the both of them. and the police were called so there is a written record of this incident).

My son threw everything in the house and had the meltdown of all meltdowns. My husband kept trying to calm him down. My son's friend ran out of the house, scared to death.When my son threatened to get a gun and blow his father's head off, my husband called the police.

The police came and came in the house and found my son all sweaty and in a mind frame of hate. The policeman told my son to SIT DOWN AND SHUT UP AND RESPECT YOUR FATHER. My son said "go f yourself'.

My son has never used those words in our house in his life. But that day he lost it completely.

The policeman put him in his place and my son stopped mouthing off. It's all impulse control (or lack of it) that was going on at this time.

The police asked my husband if he wanted to press charges. He said no.

When they left, my son retired to his room. I was in my uncle's car coming home, and I used the car phone to phone home. My husband was on one extension and my son on the other.

Here's what I heard from my husband. "The police just left". I said 'What???"

My son then says: 'I'm going to kill him, if I had a gun, I'd kill him".

My uncle who is listening, was going "oh my god". I'm going "oh my god".

We drove up to my house and I look at my uncle knowing I can't even invite him into my house because I don't know what's going on there. My uncle just looked at me sadly and said "go inside". you'll figure this out".

I walk into a calm house, my husband was just sitting on the couch going "i have no idea what to tell you, the police just left". I walk into my son's room and found him like a deflated balloon and he was saying "I hate him, I hate him".

I said to my husband "did you press charges". He said "no, I didn't do it because of you". I said 'then you don't know me very well do you, you know I believe in accountability". That's when I got the "but he's our son" talk.

Don't give me "he's our son". I never went for that either. I beleive if you act up, you pay the price, how else are you going to learn accountability, or responsiblity??

So I had a talk with my son. He wasn't one bit sorry, remorseful. He kept saying "it was my fishing pole, he had no right" I said "I happen to agree with you on that one, but now how you handled it". "You don't go around threatening your father, and you know this".

He went on like this until the next day. We drove him to the police station, I walked in (he was in the back seat still defiant over this).

I walked into the police station and spoke to the police officer who told me and I quote: "Lady, we see this every single day, parents change their mind and want to press charges, but it's too late, your husband should have done this yesterday, you can't come in the next day and press charges".

So we went home. I told my son, "if you ever go off like this on your father, or on me, you will be arrested". He never did it again.

He graduated from high schoo (no more incidents). He went to college on a full scholarship (absolutely no incidents), He did very well.

He moved out at age 20 and you know the rest.

I once asked him "why did you move away? and he said "well, would you have let me stay home and support me? and I said "are you out of your mind, what parent does that".??? And he said "now you know why I left".

So everything we did, every therapy, EVERYTHING we did, even though it was for the right reason, well, it was to no avail.

Some kids, well some you can reach, and some you can't.

It's a hard story.

But moms and dads out there. We all have stories, now don't we??

Melody,

Thank you so much for sharing your experience.

I admire you very much, more parents should be like you.

I appreciate the fact the you didn't sugar-coat it, it is a tough road to follow.

It's so important to get help in the early stages... i've been fightiing this since the beginning of last year.

I don't want her to fall through the cracks... she will if i don't fight for her.

Melody,
I know you did everything. You don't have to explain. :hug:

My point was that twenty years ago, things were different. Ten years ago, things improved and behavior modification became more common. I know it was hard to spank your child (Your DH)....but it proves my point that this form of dicipline more than likely made him internalize things. Hide them.

I tried the spankings, but it changed nothing, and the tantrums became worse. My point was that I was lucky to find a doctor who changed my thinking, my DH thinking, and my DD's thinking. We learned new behaviors that made all the difference. It was never EASY for us. The teen years were very difficult, aren't they all? :) I did spank my DD (though it happened seldom to begin with). The spankings never changed her behavior, in fact, made her lash out more.

This of course may be the difference between Asperingers and ADHD.

A child learns to take responsibility through the modification process....Like I said, it goes against every therory one has as a parent. You can't see how it will change things when you first start. But then the changes begin to happen.

Self blame is the beginning of all these things that happen to our kids. It's not about us, its about them. Once we get past the blame game, accept things must change....there can be hope.

I hope I'm coming accross ok...I really mean this all with a good heart and much love!!! We are talking apples and organges here, different dx's. Different environments, life experience....the list goes on. I agree that those coming behind us can learn a great deal from both of us....we have walked the road and can look back. You know 20/20 :)

I just had a deep conversation with my DD about Darwins therory, the world we live in....very intellectual and deep. I hope this for Misshaylees Mother. To offer hope that in time, they can grow up to be the very person you DREAMED they would be. Her threads topic is basically tears that her dreams were over. I wanted to asure her that its not always true. There is hope.

It sounds to me like you did all the right things. Don't get me started on my DH's youngest son who I called the police on, put him in jail....the works. That son has been gone now for 5 years. Doubt we will ever hear from him again....sad....but he is one we could not save...no matter what we did. I know the story from both sides :(

I have to do some chores....Have a good day everyone!!