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Old 12-08-2009, 09:03 PM #21
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There are 28 US states that do not currently partake in the submitting of the mentally ill records (thank God for some decency in the world).

I believe that submitting of those records is a mass violation of HIPPA privacy, and that if they want to buy a gun its their right.

What they intend to do with it.. well, so long as they don't go off and do a Virginia Tech thing (which is why they rediculously want these records, when they have no proof that the person was mentally ill, they just assume the person was "off their rocker", and thus all mentally ill persons are capable of going to their college and opening fire)

NE how, here is a list of the states that violate patient confidentiality:
The states that provide some or all mental health records are Alabama, Arizona, Arkansas, California, Colorado, Florida, Georgia, Hawaii, Iowa, Kentucky, Louisiana, Michigan, New Jersey, New Hampshire, New Mexico, North Carolina, Utah, Vermont, Virginia, Washington and Wyoming.
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Old 12-08-2009, 09:58 PM #22
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It isn't too bad. I had to get off meds to really know if my IVIG is working well....I have a very high ANA and other autoimmune markers, and I want to know what is what. It has taken years to get a good clinical picture and my diagnosis is still morphing.

I keep telling myself it is all a matter of physiology. Sure there are real bad days, but, in the long run, I want a to have a good handle on what is disease versus what is med side effects, or tolerance WD.

I am on one side of the mountain and you on the other, but, hey, you have legs and you will walk over the top, and be fine....I suggest you discuss cutting back on fentanyl, by 12.5mcg steps and have some oxycodone for step down. You may not get totally off oxy or hydro, it just depends.

I don't know if you have PN, but if you do, make sure that you don't have some other disease process evolving before you have the stimulator put in. They told me my PN was idiopathic and now 5 years later, my ANA is thru the roof, and my C4 is low. I never know what a blood draw will bring.
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Old 12-08-2009, 11:28 PM #23
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Is 'Paradoxical Pain Syndrome' and 'Tolerance Withdrawal' basically the same thing?
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Old 12-09-2009, 08:59 AM #24
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I am sure there are differences. I imagine that chronic use of any medication may make us need ever increasing dosages.

Not every one gets paradoxical pain. I actually felt LESS pain when I went off fentanyl, and increasing the dose of it, would have likely caused more pain. I can't explain that phenomenon. I also felt more anxiety and pain on meds intended to decrease anxiety. I have a lot of paradoxical effects to meds. Just not wired right I guess. Assumptions are made by docs that all people function the same. This is not true. 10% of Caucasians lack the
D26 enzyme which metabolized a lot of common drugs such as SSRIs and antipsychotics, such as abilify and zyprexa and risperdal.

Tolerance Withdrawal should be relieved by upping the dose, but understand that this will result in ever increasing dosages. Paradoxical Pain is not relieved by upping the dose.

Interdose Withdrawal is when you experience withdrawal symptoms when the drug starts to wear off. You have to look up the half life for each drug. I was sick for months with interdose withdrawal until a doc figured out that I was experiencing that. That was back in 2000, and involved a dose of xanax at bedtime only. I would wake at 3am in incredible distress. Years later, I ended up on klonopin for sleep.....bad idea. That has a longer half life, up to 80 hours. You don't get into major withdrawal until 3 days after you quit. Ugh. It takes a good 30-60 days to get it all out of your system as it is lipophilic (stored in fat cells), then your nervous system has to reprogram itself. Interdose withdrawal can take place on a short acting medication or if you metabolize your long acting shorter than the script. Like 2 days for fentanyl versus 3.

Whenever people have unexplained disease, it makes sense to look at meds.

At least now, I have a good idea of my disease level, and can make sense of my lab work, as far as correlating symptoms to labs.

A lot of disease is iatrogenic, but you can't know what is what, if you are reacting to meds. I don't know what you have, if you have PN, a spinal cord stimulator is for central pain, and PN may go unrelieved. This is all fairly new technology. Don't get rushed into any procedure until you have fully researched it, and have answers as to why you are suffering from pain. Keep in mind, that 5 different docs may give you 5 different opinions.

Last edited by cyclelops; 12-09-2009 at 09:19 AM.
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Old 12-10-2009, 07:16 PM #25
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Here I look at my Lyrica, Tramadol and Oxycodone. What a friggin cocktail. Oh...did I mention Lexapro for my depression/anxiety,gemfibrozil for my cholesterol, and atenolol for the blood pressure. Enough already!!

I have to get off the Oxy....possibly reduce the Tramadol and Lyrica. It is scary. I missed two days without the so-called synthetic opiate Tramadol, and boy did I feel crummy. I can imagine removing the big one from the mix. But, I have to put a stop to the madness. In order to get complete relief I have begun taking more of the 5mg tabs of oxy. I do not like the pattern this is taking. I will have to satisfy myself with partial pain relief and avoid the consequences of narcotic overdose.
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Old 12-11-2009, 09:44 AM #26
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Jak, You are on a lot of nervous system depressants and going off them is going to cause some substantial discomfort, and you have a stressful job to deal with. Perhaps your doc could advise you how to decrease drugs. You can't tackle all of them at once without serious issues.

I am not anti-opiate. I have to use a vicodin now and then, like once or twice per week. I am in substantial pain, but ironically, I was in more pain when I used a lot of pain meds daily.

I no longer work out of the home either. Every one is different. I am in the situation that I can adjust my life to the low level of energy and high level of pain that I have, and that seems preferable to the side effects I had on drugs.

I do not want to imply any value judgment on using any pain meds, I just want people to be aware that in some people these meds cause more pain.

I am all for pain relief, provided it does not mess me up and make things worse. For me, apparently due to some weirded out nervous system or inadequate liver enzyme, I do not do well with drugs.

Any one see the special on the really old indo-european mummies? They found a shaman, around 4,000 years old.....he had 'medical marijuana' on him, LOL. Relieving pain is fine....as long as it does not cause a bigger problem.

I am most revved up about benzodiazepines, since the withdrawals, whether interdose, tolerance or discontinuance, are really awful. I never, ever want to go thru that again. I never suspected that benzodiazepines could cause such awful symptoms and hideous pain.

Unfortunately, I still have disease process going on, but fortunately now, I can figure out exactly what is what.
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Old 12-11-2009, 08:25 PM #27
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My Dad took early retirement at 55. Anxiety...panic attacks...back then they didn't understand the whole serotonin thing. He was on valium for 25 years. I did get my Anxiety/depression under control with Lexipro. I know the chemical stirring that is going on with the narco crap. I do need a good game plan. I hope to hold on for another year and a half, and then I can retire. I can deal with the pain without dealing with predatory offenders and such.
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Old 12-11-2009, 08:30 PM #28
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Sign me up.

There is a term some pain docs like to use "Drug Holiday".

Believe me, there ain't no 'holiday' about it! But basically, in trying to keep tolerance levels down, backing off the meds is the only way to do it .
Easier said than done......that's basically why i went further out on a limb by asking about 'Naltrexone' .....and MrsD had some good info on these type meds (further up on this thread). The websites she provided explain the advantages/disadvantages.
There ARE options out there. The hard part is getting the right Doc to really sit down and individualize our situations and chemical makeup. Even at that, it's up to US to be the real detective.

Getting support from other pain sufferers has been the BEST medicine.
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Old 12-12-2009, 11:43 AM #29
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I'm going to cut down my oxy from 10 mgs 3 x's a day to 2 x's a day. Also I cut the Lyrica from 2 in the morning...to 1 in the morning. Skipping the noon and just taking one at night. Also cutting the tramadol back from 3 x's a day to morning and night. I am determined.
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Old 12-12-2009, 04:40 PM #30
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Default i empathize jakatak

You and i are in the same boat and my heart goes out to you.
Just be careful and make sure your doc is aware of what you are doing.
Maybe concentrate on cutting one at a time..... ? because if you are making changes/adjustments to several simultaneously, then you might have a hard time figuring out which med you are benefiting the most from.
It's always best to make certain your doc approves. He (hopefully) is looking out for your best interest.
Plus, keeping a 'journal' helps me to keep track of when i started/stopped certain meds and dietary habits.
Keep us posted! We all can learn alot from each other, even tho our chemical makeup are all different.
Currently i am sticking to a new vitamin/herbal cocktail, but i also have changed some of my dietary habits. Hopefully i can eventually ween out the pain meds. Some meds (such as my thyroid medication) DON'T mess with. It'll send my body into mayhem and i'll be back to square one.

Hang in there.
We're all in the same boat.......
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