First off, Moi - I'm not picking on you. My head has been spinning, and this quote of yours brought me back to that chatty homeless woman who was shot on the street. Yeah, it still bothers me - has nothing to do with you or anyone here.

In another thread, you said "It is clear in other scriptures that God expects us to make judgments, but they must be made with love."

Some relatives of this homeless woman came out of the woodwork and said the homeless woman suffered from epilepsy and became confused and irritable following her seizures. I hear that is common with epilepsy.

Again, IMO - a compassionate heart could have talked that woman through her confused state and discovered she suffers from epilepsy. A compassionate heart could have called an ambulance to care for her in a hospital instead of spitting in her face and calling an officer to cart her off to prison.

She's receiving treatment now, but she's also facing the death penalty.

So, yeah, if I'm going to judge someone I'll judge that woman boarding the bus. I'm aware it's not a judgment made with love for the woman boarding the bus, but I feel VERY sorry for that poor homeless woman suffering from epilepsy. I also feel VERY sorry for the policeman who had to take the call. I also feel VERY sorry for his fellow officers who had to open fire on the woman. I also feel VERY sorry for all the grieving family members.

On a selfish level, I know people won't bother to stop and think if they see me in a homeless state. If my husband dies and I do lose my home, do you really think I stand a chance of finding someone on the street who will judge me with love?

What does "judging with love" mean? Anyone care to give it a shot, so to speak?

KM,

I am always up for discussions and I know you are not picking on...moi....

first off, I am not a "religious" person. But...unlike a lot of atheists out there who'd shut the doors(and that's their right)...I have actually left my doors wide open...

I've been reading a lot of philosophy books in the past few years and recently, I've started reading the bible here and there again because I like a lot of the "philosophy" behind it...

what I've posted to BJ was actually a cut and paste I took from another site, and it was pertaining to her thread...

I don't agree with everything in the quote but I had thought that a lot of it does make sense when pertaining to BJ (and may be to some others as well) so it might help BJ cause she has a deep faith in her own religion...but how she'll see that will be how she'll see it...

we all see things differently...perspectives, I think some would call it......

I don't always agree with EVERYTHING but I KNOW that there is always SOME truth in everything...

You know, for me...I have learned to treat everything as an INDIVIDUAL issue...I don't care to lump everything together.

I vote independently although I am registered as a republican. I've voted for Clinton and I've voted for Bush and I've voted for Ralph Nadar whenever I don't care for the others...

So, I don't use a precedence to justify the current...but I might use it as a guide and a gauge if it is similar enough...

So, I treat that issue that you've posted about the woman, about the guns, about the policemen, about the woman boarding the bus as an unique case by itself...

IF we are to get down to the nitty gritty...then I can try to ask a few questions of my own:

1) you posted: "Some relatives of this homeless woman came out of the woodwork and said the homeless woman suffered from epilepsy and became confused and irritable following her seizures."

What relatives? Why are they JUST coming out of the woodworks now? Why weren't there ANYONE in her own relatives that were able to help her in the first place? Where WERE their compassion? Where were they at before this woman became homeless??

2) in your original post, your anger turned toward the guns and then the police and others, and then it became the society's fault...

I have TS, I have been picked on all my life...I still do til this day, heckit, as soon as I walk out of my door, someone will probably pick on me. I know that some of my neighbors still do AFTER I've already told them what I have...but all I ask for, is to be treated, EQUALLY...any decisions that I've made, it would be my own...and I don't blame anybody for it. EQUALITY, I don't want special treatments...

I've been homeless myself...half of it, by choice cause I was too proud to take the offers...

I am Asian(I really didn't ever wanted to say that anywhere, cause it doesn't matter, but now, here it is...I am finally revealing part of who MOI is). At our wedding, we had blacks, whites, asians, muslims at our wedding....we were honored by all cultures, colors and race. And we loved them all and we embraced them all....still do...

but you know, when you've time and time again mentioned how the "other races" get picked on...I've always been picked on by all races...I've seen a lot of Asian jokes being thrown around by both blacks and the whites...

Should I get angry? No, I laugh with them...heckit, I could probably do a great "supplies" joke better than anyone. Heheheh..

my neighbor is an extreme redneck racist...he's openly talk badly about "others' including my own race infront of me....and believe me, I've held my own against him...

but you know what? When we were having some yard problems, he was the first one to raise his sleeves to come over and help me out...we didn't even ask...

partly, I think it's because I treat him with respect...

I've told him that I don't eat cats, and that there are those that do. But that he treats me as an individual...

so, once again. I don't want to lump people together, I even know people that are "racists" usually have some soft spots in their heart...

my biggest disagreement with your posts is that you always lump groups together...but once again, that's your view and I respect that...

and while I know your intention is to hope that people would discuss it, for me, personally, I think you alienate people further when the fingers start to point. For me..and for me only, I always feel like there is a better approach then just to point fingers and say this is wrong and that is wrong. It is NOT always as black and white as we want it to be...

but as that, I also understand where you've coming from, because I WAS full of anger growing up, and I used to just point fingers as well...but I didn't GAIN anything from it...except more anger to the point that I was self-destructive...

these days, I am too old for that...I am looking for that "zen"; for that "enlightenment" ;for that "Salvation" ;for that "light at the end of the tunnel"

I've lost too many people that I love and cared about but didn't had more time to get to know them or being with them while I was being angry...it is time, for ME..FOR ME....to try to link as many people that I care about together within my own small itsy bitsy power ...and in hopes that, for ME...FOR ME...that I can help to bring someone some happiness and joy....to share what I've found....well, happiness and joy...

I am a much better person these days...FOR ME...

3) there are many circumstances to this bus issue...

if the woman boarding the bus has just been abused by her husband, or has some sort of fear herself and she herself is NOT of a stable mind. Then, who can blame her for calling the cops. IF this woman felt unsafe and didn't know what to do, we are usually trained that calling the police SHOULD help resolve the issue. Because the police have the means and the rights to help the epileptic woman to a hospital or somewhere where she could be safe.

having a compassionate heart also means needing compassionate means.

They were all RIDING the bus...who would've had the means to bring this woman to the hospital?

Yes, I agree that the woman boarding the bus maybe could've tried harder, but who knew her state of being of mind?

4) whether you see it or not, there IS one death. That policeman's...
he is DEAD...gone...

if you are saying that his death is justified because he carried a gun and then getting back to the whole gun issue, this then becomes a whole another subject...

I have stated my opinion about guns already...I don't like them, but I don't think banning them will solve the issues. I think regulation will help a bit..

It's like drugs...we prohibit drugs but how many times have we drove by the drug house or know people that use coccaine and other drugs?

with that said, I don't mean that we should just throw our arms into the sky and give up. I just think we need some serious restructuring...from bottom to top...

5) I understand your passion. I commend you for it. But often times, in my opinion, your passion turns into hatred and then people that reads it absorbs it...of course they are going to disagree with you...it isn't a lashing against you. They just want you to know that THEY, are NOT that way, is all...

KM, if I was to walk by you tomorrow, and I would call for help. I believe in every fiber of my being that you would reach your hands out to me...

As the same, I believe that curious would do the same for me as well...

we don't all have to get along...we don't all have to like eachother...but we can all try to "make judgement" with love...

but NOT all people do that...a lot of folks make judgements out of ignorance...and I don't care for those...but there are time, judgements ARE made out of love...I guess that's the point...

I can give you an example...when we visit with our grand kids, they can be a handful and then some...our grandson is at an age where he is into everything, wanting to touch this and touch that...

and if he can't he'll cry and throw fits and such...so, if he wanted to touch a HOT iron. Should I make a judgement call there and tell him not to? And SLAP his hand when he reaches for it?
That slap and judgement call wasn't done out of hatred or ignorance. It was one out of love...

If my children come to me tomorrow and ask me if they can have sex with a 100 people...and ask me to not judge them. I damn well will judge them and tell them that that is ignorance and that my judgement IS done out of love...


Sometimes, we HAVE to make judgements, just as I've seen you've made judgement with many things already, and I've seen you made it with passion/love...

And I hope you know that this is said with total respect...




PS, I just want to add that your posts really never offend me or anger me. I've always try to look at things from your view as well for I've walked some of the paths that you've walked and I have empathy for you. But I do NOT feel sorry for you....because we all make our own choices and how we find our own happiness and dealings and we are all different...

All that I can keep on offering you, is an open ear to listen if you ever shall need and open arms and hugs, if you shall ever need.

Moi

Did you have any ugly homeless strangers dressed in rags and flailing their arms at your wedding? LOL/jk This isn't about race/culture - it's about "ugly" homeless people. If/when I join them, no one will be able to pick me out of the crowd - not even my friends here.

Please don't take this personally. "Judging with love" is an instruction I hear a LOT from people everywhere, and it confuses me. They can never give me solid examples of how it plays out in real life. They can't explain how it would apply to judging MY life, especially when they don't know the history of my life. They don't understand the consequences of judgments - the ripple effect that follows.

I realize my situation will also fall into a "unique case of it's own." When I was younger, I was able to run. I can barely walk now. When I was younger, I didn't appear as frightening as I do now and I had better control over my emotions and table manners. I don't stand a chance on the streets, and carrying a gun for protection isn't the answer either. Homeless people are not allowed to carry weapons.

I'm sure somewhere along the line her family considered her too much of a burden or didn't have the ways and means to take her in themselves.

There's no way my son would be able to support me - hasn't even gone to college yet. There's no way I'd go live with my sister - I love her too much. She gets physically ill when people eat with their mouths open - my food often falls out of my mouth now as it is when I eat. She also does not have the ways and means to care for me either. The same goes for my in-laws and friends. The only friend I know that would and could take me in is dying.

I won't place my life in the hands of charitable organizations because I don't trust them to treat me as a human being - they never have, why start now? The same goes for medical institutions because they will eventually get tired of me and place me in chains (or leather restraints). My doctors care very much, but they also know there is nothing they can do for me.

I'd like to know there are other people out there who are not afraid of people or too busy to be bothered with people whose attitude or appearance is too "ugly" for their taste. I'd like to be able to identify who would be willing to keep me company on the streets without trying to smother me in one form or another. In my book, someone who can truly judge with love is someone I'd like to know out there when I'm all alone.

So, yeah, a little angry and scared here because I'm cornered and at the end of the line. On the streets, I will be judged harshly. It may appear I hold hatred inside me, but I don't.

Maybe I made the mistake of using your words in the title and giving you a heads up this is not about you. This is absolutely not about you or anyone here. I just wanted to hear what others thought about "judging strangers with love."

Maybe it's not possible to judge others with love.

You are just like a dog with a bone dear Kathy....you won't leave it alone.

Ok...just my take on this and I really don't like to assume that I have any idea of the fear you live with on a daily basis but you always go to the worst case scenario! Maybe it won't happen...maybe you'll get hit by a bus before your condition worsens. Maybe the world will blow up..maybe the polar bears will mass...

My point is that we can't know our future...yes, I can hear you rushing to answer that you know yours because of your mom. It's about choices you will make when your life changes and you're certainly intelligent enough to know that you will have choices. Granted, you may not like some of them. But if you become a street person...it will be because you chose to.

ZIP

I realize discussing my situation in life can be too overwhelming for some people. I also realize my request for discussion on this topic is too upsetting for this forum.

Go ahead and delete this thread. Thank you.

Was it something I said? Or didn't say?

Kathy,
I don't know you or anyone here really but I do know that is a fear we all have and since its unlikely to happen today, why not do the one day at a time with things likes this??
Just my Opinion, Hope I did not step on any toes here??

Thank you Junie - that is what I try to do. My days become unbearable though sometimes (intense physical pain and emotional stress), so my only escape is to look to my past and try to remember all the good times. When I do that, I'm accused of living in the past.

My present is either lying in bed in a dark room where my father died, sitting at a computer in a dark room where my grandmother died, or going to the hospital that killed my mother. It's not enough of a present to take my mind off my pain and physical condition.

My future is too terrifying, but people tell me I should I plan for my future. With my resources, being homeless on the streets of Chicago is the only place where I will feel free to live out my life with a little pride and dignity. My first choice would be to live indoors, be treated with respect, and to be surrounded with love. It's a dream, but I realize it's only a pipe dream at this point.

I don't mind the idea of being buried in a pauper's grave with a bunch of other homeless "no-name" people. In the past people have said they plan to spit and defecate on my grave after I die. HAHA! They won't be able to find me.

I had to shake my head at the news coverage of the policeman's funeral yesterday. Everyone was so thankful and proud he sacrificed his life to remove a "deranged lunatic" off the streets.

I just wanted to remind you that you are loved...I know that your son loves you and misses you...I know that your husband is a compassionate, caring man cause Doody told me so after meeting the two of you and I know, that you know, that I care about you...I hear the fear you are feeling and I'm sorry...that doesn't help at all but I am.

My dear neice was cremated and her ashes put in Lake Michigan so she is roaming freely.....we often go up to the lake and say Hi to her...next time you go to the lake...throw her a kiss please.

All 3 of my sons said I could live with them but I told them there is no way it would work as I plan to live on my own to the very last moment and I will worry about it when the time comes, God knows we have enough to worry about to make it through each day, call me a coward but I avoid news, and other depressing things at all cost! I guess I will cross that bridge when I come to it....the only one I have in my whole family that I feel I can depend on when my husband is gone is my baby sister... I almost raised her and the other 4 could care less once I could no longer work and pass out money and credit cards!