Originally Posted by Alffe

I think the "danger" in talking about our suicidal feelings is that it could trigger someone. I know we are all adults here but we have, on a couple of occasions had someone new come in and threaten to kill themselves. That isn't acceptable nor what we are about. As long as we are clear about the difference...feelings vs actions I don't think there would be a problem.

Maybe a mod could jump in here with an opinion.

Originally Posted by Nik-key

I also know I can't change the world just because I wish it so. But, I DO believe one person CAN and DOES make a difference.

Originally Posted by Nik-key

Long before I was a survivor of my Dad's suicide, I was a survivor of my own. It was incredibly hard, but I did reach out and speak with several people about my thoughts to end my life, so I could end my pain. Dad was one of the people who gave me the strength and courage to hang on.

It was a painful experience, both physically and emotionally. Through that long journey came an acceptance of the pain I would have to face every day, with that acceptance, also came hard fought for peace. I went from wishing to God I could die, to regarding my disease as a gift.

Due to all I had to experience to get from point A to point B, I decided to become a support group leader and a phone support to those afflicted with my pain. As ((BMW)) knows, the disease we share, is penned the suicide disease... I felt a great need to share with others that one CAN survive and truly enjoy life, with and despite this pain. I handled suicide calls all the time. I did not hide from my pain, instead I opened up and shared. Through that, I know I made a difference. I know through letters and calls I received later, that I did save lives.

I will NOT stop talking about my Dad. I am not ashamed he took his life. NO ONE has the power to make me feel I should be either!!!! He was and will always be my hero. I know his strength, he fought as hard and as long as he could. It is tragic, it is heartbreaking!!! I do, and forever will wish , I had known he was sick again and that he was able to tell me how depressed he was. He did reach out, he did tell his doctor he was depressed, sadly nothing was done to help him. That HAS to change, and I am damn well going to do everything in my power to help.

So, I may not be able to change the world, but I am making a difference. I am not afraid of that elephant, hell we invited him to dinner! We can all make a difference, WE ARE just by posting here!

My sister is a victim of domestic violence. It is taboo as well. She tried to hide it for many years. She finally found the strength to leave him and is now divorced and living with me. It was the hardest thing she has ever done, death threats, court hearing after hearing, restraining orders etc etc, it has been two years of hell for her. But through it she found her strength - I can hear her ROAR! and I am so damn proud of her I could burst! They have a motto in her DV support group...............Silence - Kills. It is so true for suicide and depression too.

We all need to keep breaking the silence. suicide is not as taboo as it once was......... but the stigma IS still there. I believe the more people keep talking, sharing - the more coalitions like the one I just joined form across the country, the world, the stigma might just be erased in my life time. Holding onto hope

Originally Posted by Nik-key

((Mistiis)) I thank you for opening up and sharing with us. You truly do have a way with words, a gift.

I had several childhood traumas that I had to work through as a young adult. I was going to say it wasn't fear that was the hardest part, it was knowing the emotional hell I would have to go through to heal. But, that is fear isn't it!

I'm not a parent, but I am a big sister to two of my sisters, one 8 years younger, (whom I practically raised) the other 18 years. I am also a proud aunty. I know it was my past that made me reach out to them, (with parents approval of course) to let them know even though many loved them they would have at least one person they would always be safe with. There is a difference between feeling loved, and feeling safe. I think it is vital.

Problems, issues and "elephants" are more readily and easily discussed if one feels safe. I didn't have that as child and I wanted to make sure they did. I let each of them know, they could always come to me, for any reasons. If for example they had been drinking, or were pregnant, call me. No questions would be asked, no explanations needed... just reach out and I will always be there, "you will always be safe with me".

I was pleasantly surprised at how many questions they came up with, well what if I did this? What if someone did this to me? I let them know NO MATTER WHAT, my love for them would not change and I would keep them safe and help them through any problem. They did call on me many many many times and I am so very thankful.

Now that someone we all love did take their own life, we openly talk about suicide as well. It is very difficult to say the least. In order to break the cycle of pushing problems aside, only so they come back and bite you in the butt later, they have to be worked through. The sooner the better.

My point in sharing this is I believe we must start anew in both protecting and educating "our children" We teach them morals, manners etc. we must also teach them and give them the tools they need to face many of life’s challenges. IMHO, I believe the best place to start is at home.

Again ((Mistiis)) thank you for sharing, you helped me today

Originally Posted by mistiis

well, alrighty then, lets talk about it.....First, I would like to draw attention to BMW's new signature...it has a lot of significance....finding our voice can be the difference between life, and death. For others, as well as ourselves. A truer word could not be said. Yes, I realize that some of us have had the experience of finding our voice, finally, only, sadly, to not be heard, understood, or gotten the needed help. But that is another issue.

I hope this will make sense, as I will try to just run through it, as I have lost several very well thought out posts that took me a long time to write.

Many of us have 'boogey men' in the closet. We don't know when he, it, or they, will jump out and trigger responses that we don't understand. Why?? Partly because we don't face them. Why?? Because of fear. Fear also comes in many guises, and wears many faces from societal issues to family issues. I am going to try not to get lost here....

The boogey man in the closet can be traumatic childhood experiences...running the full spectrum from sheer terror to fears of expression that result from interactions with adults in our lives. When not resolved they sit in the closet. And when the closet gets 'opened' if they are piled up, and there are many of them, they fall out. They are hard to look at. They are not pretty. They are not fun to pick up and look at. Yet, if we do not, they will pop out at us at unexpected moments in our life. Moments will arrive that will be conducive to dealing with them, if we are open to it. That does not mean that it will be easy.

The boogey man can consist of those stigmas. Like the ones that males face. I have typed a long post on this and will post it in another thread. We have several now going on this 'elephant'...I hope that it doesn't become confusing. Moi, thank you for starting this thread. You are so honest, and open, it really helps.

I am trying to get to the 'why' we don't reach out, and the 'why' we have those thoughts and feelings in the first place. I realize that I have to come from my perspective since those are the lenses that I see through. There are places in our feelings where we 'meet'...all of us do...

I think there are too many possible answers to those why questions to try to answer in one post.

I had an interesting experience at our Thanksgiving table. One that has me quite disturbed. Someone brought up the incident of the young man who commited suicide online. Well, I had been reading about it, so naturally, I became involved in the conversation. I had a lot to say. But, because of the reaction of those around the table, I found myself unable to say what I would have liked to. The attitudes shocked me. They shocked me into silence. And, once again, into my own little world. My children, and my brothers and sisters do not know about my past. They don't know about my suicide attempt at the age of 12. They don't know about my past trauma as a very young child. They know only very little about the suicide attempt that I made while in the hospital, due to psychosis from a non-functioning thyroid that went un-diagnosed. And I'm not sure they realize how close they came to losing me. According to statistics I am very 'fortunate' to be alive.

OK, I am running on.....its hard to communicate when there are emotional walls of anykind. They can be really hard to break through. But, the good thing is, that once you begin to break through that wall, it seems, to become easier to do it.

Moi, I am with you on the quiet type. I don't tell people when I am battling with suicidal thoughts, but I am becoming better at it. At least, we can come here. I guess, when you are a survivor....you learn 'how' to survive better. And I think that we have been given a gift. And I think that when we receive a gift it is nice to pass it on. Especially when it is the gift of life. A gift we were given......before we could help pass it on in this way. Lighting each other's candles...I like that graphic....

Ok...I don't know how this will come out. I am not going to take the time to check it, or I might lose it.....

Originally Posted by mistiis

well, alrighty then, lets talk about it.....First, I would like to draw attention to BMW's new signature...it has a lot of significance....finding our voice can be the difference between life, and death. For others, as well as ourselves. A truer word could not be said. Yes, I realize that some of us have had the experience of finding our voice, finally, only, sadly, to not be heard, understood, or gotten the needed help. But that is another issue.

I hope this will make sense, as I will try to just run through it, as I have lost several very well thought out posts that took me a long time to write.

Many of us have 'boogey men' in the closet. We don't know when he, it, or they, will jump out and trigger responses that we don't understand. Why?? Partly because we don't face them. Why?? Because of fear. Fear also comes in many guises, and wears many faces from societal issues to family issues. I am going to try not to get lost here....

The boogey man in the closet can be traumatic childhood experiences...running the full spectrum from sheer terror to fears of expression that result from interactions with adults in our lives. When not resolved they sit in the closet. And when the closet gets 'opened' if they are piled up, and there are many of them, they fall out. They are hard to look at. They are not pretty. They are not fun to pick up and look at. Yet, if we do not, they will pop out at us at unexpected moments in our life. Moments will arrive that will be conducive to dealing with them, if we are open to it. That does not mean that it will be easy.

The boogey man can consist of those stigmas. Like the ones that males face. I have typed a long post on this and will post it in another thread. We have several now going on this 'elephant'...I hope that it doesn't become confusing. Moi, thank you for starting this thread. You are so honest, and open, it really helps.

I am trying to get to the 'why' we don't reach out, and the 'why' we have those thoughts and feelings in the first place. I realize that I have to come from my perspective since those are the lenses that I see through. There are places in our feelings where we 'meet'...all of us do...

I think there are too many possible answers to those why questions to try to answer in one post.

I had an interesting experience at our Thanksgiving table. One that has me quite disturbed. Someone brought up the incident of the young man who commited suicide online. Well, I had been reading about it, so naturally, I became involved in the conversation. I had a lot to say. But, because of the reaction of those around the table, I found myself unable to say what I would have liked to. The attitudes shocked me. They shocked me into silence. And, once again, into my own little world. My children, and my brothers and sisters do not know about my past. They don't know about my suicide attempt at the age of 12. They don't know about my past trauma as a very young child. They know only very little about the suicide attempt that I made while in the hospital, due to psychosis from a non-functioning thyroid that went un-diagnosed. And I'm not sure they realize how close they came to losing me. According to statistics I am very 'fortunate' to be alive.

OK, I am running on.....its hard to communicate when there are emotional walls of anykind. They can be really hard to break through. But, the good thing is, that once you begin to break through that wall, it seems, to become easier to do it.

Moi, I am with you on the quiet type. I don't tell people when I am battling with suicidal thoughts, but I am becoming better at it. At least, we can come here. I guess, when you are a survivor....you learn 'how' to survive better. And I think that we have been given a gift. And I think that when we receive a gift it is nice to pass it on. Especially when it is the gift of life. A gift we were given......before we could help pass it on in this way. Lighting each other's candles...I like that graphic....

Ok...I don't know how this will come out. I am not going to take the time to check it, or I might lose it.....

Originally Posted by Burntmarshmallow

I am trying to chose my words carefully but I cannot guarantee that will happen.
I am replying to Mois first post as I have not really read all of the responses yet. So please forgive me if I don't touch on anyone else's posts here.
Hard to look back but I have traveled so far that looking back at my first attempt I feel extremely stupid, foolish and embarrassed, young .
So as some know I grew up with mean older brother who abused me when mom and dad were not around. My parents had health issues My dad had 3 heart attacks and then when I was still a little kid he had a triple by pass surgery. When I was 8 my mom had cancer she lost both breast to cancer but she is a survivor and is still kicking in her 80s. Anyways I wanted to say I was left at other family members houses a lot cus mom or dad sick. I also had a mean brother who abused me when my parents were not around. So I grew up poor. I lived in kinda rich town in Conn. My brother would hit me ,us, my mom and Dad around I will swear on the bible no lie that the cops were at our house at the very least 4 times EVERY week either to break up a physical fight bro beating mom or bro beating up on dad. If not that it would be to “question” my bro or arrest him as he liked to break in our neighbors houses or take a car for a joy ride.

I guess I am sharing this so maybe someone will understand things that lead me to the first time.
I was in high school one night my school friends all wanted to go to MC donalds. It was in Feb still snow in fact the roads were icy. I didn't go but 2 boys from the neighborhood went and my girlfriend from up street and another semi friend went. Well they hit a pole and 2 died at scene and one other a day later ...the last a week later. A few weeks after that happened . Dad, twin bro and I had come back from roller skating . My dad decided to bring us to Wendy's fast food for a snack . Mom came too. I will skip the so vividly and easy to recall details. But my Dad died at home that night after we got back from wendys.

School just sucked. I had just lost my click of friends forever I just lost my dad forever.. I am leaving Steven out of this but he was a friend who committed suicide when I was in high school. I would go to school and look around at all the other kids . Kids who only had to deal with what new shirt they will wear. Or whats for dinner. I was so not fitting in with that. I was so different . They could not relate or begin to understand and there is no way I could explain .these feelings the loneliness the anger the .
How could I explain when I never had some of these feelings before and I don't understand them myself.
So I recall how I would just for hours be thinking of things like “BMW” is there anything really truly good about growing up? Has there been anything good that has happened so far. . Look where you at right now BMW . Your friends crashed into a telephone pole, your dad died right in front of you and you couldn't do anything about it not one thing. You really think you can make new friends BMW with the reputation your older brother has given to your last name? Ya think anyone will want to be friends with a poor freak like you BMW ...do you see the look on the teachers faces when they call your name ?!! .
Then I would think of the future and that didn't look good at all. So I thought different things.
I started cutting arms legs. No one noticed and it felt good it helped me deal. Helped me deal with being the freak at school . I just felt like the freak in my tiny teenage world . Then I ...I started feeling like I didn't want to be here. Yes it was a personal thing all of it. Private. I decided to take a bunch of pills and cut myself. Well it didn't work. I ended up in hosp then counciling. I guess that time I was thinking I am a bad person I am useless hopeless worthless no good, not liked... a waste a mistake.
I even thought I was really suppose to be in that car ,I really was suppose to die with my friends..I really am suppose to be dead...so just do it. Those are easy things to say now but back then I was just a confused scared sad little teenager. I didn't have a clue .

My second time or times I thought /felt like ending my life was after my accident I had in 1999. I have beautiful family 2 little girls(big now tho) and hub. I had accident a semi hit me from behind .Broke jaw, steel plates on each side of jaw fake teeth jaw bone shaved. Head injury .etc etc... On meds after med after med for face pain for depression for anything I guess .I had head injury and med all the different types and strengths and its just a fog really but I know one time back then. In my oh so damn dark and lonely horrible time back then when I was trapped , be humbled, helpless but to lay in my bed not being able do do anything . Not eat not keep any liquid down. Not sit up to look out window... Not play with my kids not do anything but shake and shake. That is how I saw myself being for the rest of my life. And I did not want that. Not for me not for my family. I felt horrible what I was putting my family thought . My girls . I would not put anyone I loved and cared about so much would not put them through this a week longer. I couldn't take the pain , I couldn't explain the pain, nothing was helping me . I told my pain doctor straight up what I was feeling and how I didn't want to be alive anymore, how I will not be like this. I just wont. And he took my words to heart and helped me. He gave me 2 options to see if morphine would help my pain. If so he would implant a morphine pump into back of my head to treat my nerve damage. Well he iv a morphine drip to see if it would help but it did not. So He offered me the last option to try a neuro stim. Okay I was still trying to settle with the accident and the truck driving company. So this was considered a voo- doo treatment . I am the first in the U.S.A. To try a neuro stimulator for face pain. I had to fight in court for this at same time fighting for compensation. Well I won my case ... trail by jury of my peers 13 of them.. more important...
I fought myself for myself and I won .
I guess for me in those times I think about it or feel like doing it. It is because I hate what I am putting others threw, hate that I am hurting other people or that other people are going threw things because of me. That could be called quilt or shame or blame???
So I guess each time is a very different feeling or reason . Even when talking about one person. As is each loss that is felt so deep amongst us when one dose succeed in ending their life. Each reason different. Maybe a desperate act or a selfish act. Yet it could be a self -Less act a brave courageous act or ending ones life out of anger or pain..(hate of or cant handle pain lived with pain long enough...) .
The reasons are different and there is no ONE thing to call it but a loss..

On talking about it I am scared to hit the post button...but I trust that if need be a mod will remove my post .as when one suffers a head injury and they are seeking compensation...the law says there is right to go back as far as one wishes into that persons personal history..which would include any post here. So I do not want any head injuries and I do not want johnny law looking at my high school times. As they will use it against me as they did during my trial after accident.. I am so scared to post this. But in my heart it is for good, to help another and that is just what I hope it dose. Help somebody. THAT IS ALL THAT MATTERS.

I think after I hit post I will hide out in the corner and lurk. as this is kinda hard to share and i left things out but the just of it is here and the only thing i want it to do is help someone be able to reach out to ask for help , to show someone they arent alone.... for support in positive way. We are here for you just reach and keep on reaching.

PEACE
BMW
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