Hi
I just reread the first post. I meant to say during the conversation Myra said I could call her when I want to. Do you think she meant it? Yes I am feeling less pain. Right now I am jumping out of my skin. I just took two klonopin and a bath. I have been so horribly depressed for so long and have been having so many upheavals that apparently have been working out. I am so scared.

Both psychological and bipolar factors are hammering on me. I suppose I should go gently but that isn't the way I function. I am sorry you aren't feeling well. bipolar is the pits

Dear Bobby,
If she said that she can call her, she probably meant it. I sense that she is the kind of person who does not say stuff like that if she does not mean it.
I'm sorry that you have been depressed.

I've been thinking the past few days about a different life I could have had under different circumstances. That kind of thinking creeping into my day is generally not a good sign.
M.

thank you Mari
that kind of thinking isn't good for us but i don't know how to come to acceptance. I have been having the weirdest dreams and in them I am not bipolar and when I wake up I feel depressed. The world isn't open to us as it is to normals. Do you think we have to start paying attention to our strengths? Our emotions magnify so should we just try to expose ourselves to positive things? I have been living with so much fear the past months. I also don't know if it is a sign that i am getting older or my bipolar is getting worse.
bobby

Yes.
The things that you mention are similar to what my tdoc has talked about.
She doesn't even let me spend much time complaining. I think she has encouraged me to be completely and fully aware of my limitations and to accept them and move on. I'm not supposed to try to change them or challenge them.
She seems to be guiding me to be at peace with what I have and to try to work with in those boundaries.

Most of the time I can do the peace thing to a certain extent. But then other times things can get too overwhelming. Not sleeping or having one extra meeting in the week or one extra thing to respond to can be enough to throw the whole balancing act out of equilibrium.
And I at work I feel like I am trying to "pass" as normal. It is exhausting and demoralizing for me to do this -- taking a great deal of energy to try to "cover."
I am aware that other folks go through the same thing and I am not the only one, but that generally does not make it easier.


Regarding positive things:
I told her almost all music (new or old) makes me sad and that music is not available to me as a tool to make me better because it brings up unhappy memories.
She said to create new memories. .. . something like if I hear a song in the car, I can tell myself something good about what is happening -- like today is a sunny day. . . . Then I can start making good associations with the song. Something like that. Her suggestion hasn't worked yet. Music makes me sad -- no matter what kind of music.
Maybe it is not about the memories anyway. Maybe music is emotional and the emotions it brings out are sad ones -- and this is unrelated to memories.

I'm sorry that you have been living with fear. Ordinarily I might suggest that that is related to anxiety and not so much about depression.

My tdoc sets an example of being practical -- that's how I see her anyway. She has told me almost nothing about herself, but that is how she presents herself and how she encourages me to be -- to be almost brutally practical about what I am facing.

She also is big about living in the moment. . . . she encourages self-talk for example and to deal with one thing at a time -- not to anticipate a future reaction.

Mari

I like the part of her not anticipating the future. Can you do that? The present actions usually take care of the future anyways and what we tend to worry about doesn't come true usually, it is the things we don't worry about. I understand about music. I go through periods where I can't listen to music because it just floods me with emotion and it isn't happy emotion.
Where does our emotion go? I know mine is exaggerated but sometimes I feel better when I learn that a peer has the same fears.
Sometimes being practical is like using the wrong key. It is as if you are ignoring something that is raw anad which is screaming to be fixed.
I briefly threw into my sister when she mentioned something I forgot that our parents never taught us to take care of ourselves. Somehow it was as if they taught us to ignore our authentic emotions and now that has become our defense but it doesn't work since we are so filled with emotion that keeps on coming out inappropriately . How many times are you really relaxed? today i went back to bed that usually isn't that usual. the fear was too much. i wonder if my normalcy is beginning to slip away again
bobby

more thoughts...they say were are more a creative group...if so is that where are emotions supposed to go..is that where we are supposed to channel them? I started wondering when I read books if i should start imagining myself to be one of the characters or should i start telling myself make believe stories. sounds crazy doesn't it but is that a way of using up our free floating emotions?

It is so good to read these reflective and explorative posts from you.

Intellectually you do seem to be much more activated... in a good way.

I am sorry you are still experiencing fear. That is rough.

Anyway, I hope one day of crawling back under the covers need not mean crawling back into depression... just take it for what it is. one action. one day.

Your posts do have such a different and positive, reaching-for-life ring, to me. I know it is just an interpretation, but i really believe in it. I am glad for that.

Finally i just want to congratulate you for reaching out to Myra, and wish you the best establishing a new relationship with her, such as you have not had in the past.

Good job, on so many counts.

love

~ waves ~

Bobby,

I believe the reason people say we're creative people is because of our deep emotions. Some very good songs were written when the writer was depressed as an example

I wish I could get over my pride and call my sister. It was really nothing I did on my part to cause the rift between her and I. It was a matter of me getting upset with her and her getting upset because I was upset with her. For some reason when I let the people in my life know how I feel when they hurt me or upset me they get defensive and the tables get turned and they start to hate me. Like people say, a good defense is an offense. That is what the ones in my life do when I let them know they've hurt me. They take the offense and then make me look like the bad guy. There is something wrong with this and I'm not sure I can have people in my life that will do this to me. I don't want to be always dumped on and taking hurt after hurt with no way of settling it.

Take care and let us know how your doing. Have you talked to your sister again?

barbara

Hey,
Have you tried writing your sister instead of calling? Sometimes a letter is just easier. Talking is a lot more emotion-intensive and harder to start.

Dear Bobby,
I have learned not to anticipate the future.
Of course I am worrying, but I am trying to worry less. And sometimes I can succeed for a few moments or a few hours.

My students often take an attitude that if something is meant to be, it will happen. It's is sort of fatalism combined with a version of Christianity. It can be calming in a way -- to realize that my life is not within my control.

Regarding ignoring our emotions:
I think that I learned that lesson very well from my mother. She said things like
You don't have to like it; you just have to do it.
(She is a huge control freak.)


That's a parent thing that other parents say perhaps. But my mom said it and other statements like it all day long. And she often denied herself what she wanted, so I learned from her teachings and her behavior. Dad was not as nuts but he was bad enough.

Sometimes I call my sister to ask if I am remembering and interpreting something correctly. My sis had remarked in a phone call that most people don't like to go out in the rain.

Rain never stopped my mother. She did not make any adjustments due to weather -- always pushed through. So if we kids were expected somewhere, we showed up wet and frazzled with rain coat and umbrella, but we showed up. We even did this if we didn't have to go anywhere. If we would normally go outside in the yard to do something, than we were expected to go out, good weather or not.
This is so small that I hate writing it out for others to see, but I have had to re-learn how to live and I am using weather as an example.

What is hard is that with bipolar I was originally taught (Cognitive Behavioral Therapy) not to trust my emotions. I did argue with the therapist tremendously about that and over the years he made adjustments and pretty much dropped CBT altogether.
It's hard as a bipolar to trust our emotions. We're told by the docs that our brains are lying to us and that we need to push on anyway.
I'm not sure that is true.

Maybe the trick with bipolar is to learn when the brain is right and when it is wrong. Sometimes I have to give in and sometimes I have to put up a little fight.

Current tdoc thinks that relaxation techniques can kind of get us to the other side of the emotion -- so we are not giving in to it, but we are not fighting it either.
That's why she does not spend too much time in session on talking about problems. She validates the emotions and then encourages me to to think of it in a different way or to think about the problem only in terms of right now and not in terms of what it means for tomorrow.

And if the emotion is caught up in an issue that can be solved, she offers solutions. I think that is what I mean by "practical." If it can be solved, let's fix it to the extent we can. If it cannot be solved, lets reframe the issue so it is less of a problem.
Something like that.

I'm not really here yet.
I'm working on it.
M.